11214 Euthanasia Laws Are Evil According To Pope Benedict

I'm all for euthanasia and especially assisted suicide in certain cases.

[quote=juliancoll;106107]I'm all for euthanasia and especially assisted suicide in certain cases.[/quote]

Agreed, some people would welcome being put out of their misery.

Actually, to qualify that:
[quote=The Times November 26, 2008]
[b]Forced to die alone[/b]
[i]Putting across the argument for having the right to die[/i]

Sir, My adored wife of half a century took an overdose last year. She was a distinguished woman — obituaries appeared in The Times (August 16, 2007) and other newspapers a few days later. But Parkinson’s disease had robbed her of the power of speaking articulately; her beautiful italic handwriting was nothing but a bitter memory; she kept falling over and injuring herself. She knew when she had degenerated as much as she was prepared to put up with.

Asked by some well-meaning doctors and nurses what I thought of it, after a previous, obviously unsuccessful, attempt — when I had to call for help because instead of dying as she wished she had gone into a coma, and I couldn’t cope with that — I replied to their apparent surprise that I thought she had behaved rationally and courageously. When one consultant threatened to section her I told him outright that was the remark of a fool and a bully.

When the day came, I agreed to invent an unnecessary day’s work at the university library so that she could get on with it. I don’t regret it: it was what she wanted. My regret is only that because of the idiocy of the present law, my precious only heart’s darling had to die a horrible, lonely death all alone here in the house instead of having me here to help and comfort her, which was what she wanted. People such as Baroness Finlay of Llandaff can make their own arrangements. The best I can wish them is that they might learn from experience what it feels like.

Michael Grosvenor Myer

Cambridge
[/quote]
Link -> [url=http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/letters/article5232154.ece]Forced to die alone -Times Online[/url]

Now, I accept that [i]deciding the time is right[/i] is a spoilt and selfish thing to do (surely, a god who loves us would want us to submit to his will?) but I know on which side of that argument, I'd want to lie.....

How can such a thing, under certain circumstances be branded as 'evil'?

I do not hold strong religeous beliefs, am not a Roman Catholic, but I [U]do[/U] believe that there is a God and that there was a man called Jesus. But - given that I can accept that - then I can hope that just 'maybe' Jesus could perform miracles and make the sick well and the blind see. Turn water to wine and even walk on water... but only his memory remains and miracles, despite the fervent wishes of the church, are few and far between and don't [I]seem[/I] to be available to those who, after careful consideration, guidance and maybe years of excruciating pain, make the decision to end their own lives in this way.

I just cannot believe that God, or his Son, could possibly view euthanasia and the final release into their loving arms as an evil act...

The God I believe in is far more compassionate it seems, than the one that many of those in Holy Orders who carry out his ministry here on earth believe in. Yet I thought there was only one God!

Was the Roman soldier on the hill at Calvary the first to accept that a certain level of pain and suffering could not be humanely allowed? By finally releasing Jesus from such a cruel, painful fate with one thrust of his spear into Jesus' ribcage - did he not show mercy by using a form of euthanasia? I believe he did - and will always do so despite what the Vatican chooses to say!

The Catholic Church was peddling heaven to it’s believers when life was miserable, brutish and short. In order to stop it’s followers choosing to go and join the heavenly choirs, they made suicide a sin.

It was not long ago that suicides could not be buried in consecrated ground. Then again eating meat on a Friday would consign you to everlasting torment too.

CaroleB is right to point out that perhaps Jesus was the first assisted suicide, accepted by the church – his method is now known as suicide by cop.

I thank Yoda that we live in more enlightened times and the poor parents of Daniel James are not to face prosecution. Is there really a God who could condemn either them or their son for making the decisions they did?

Of course laws must be in place to prevent anyone ever being pressurised to make the decision to end their life, but if that decision is made by a person who genuinely wants to die, I believe we must accept that decision and respect their wishes.

I will say a few more things about this thread later on, as I have to work out an adequate response to many issues raised, but I need to urgently clarify some things which have been said which are not according to the New Testament and could confuse some people.
Jesus was never assisted by the Centurion to accelerate His death. He was already dead and this is why they did not broke His legs (the method at the time to do it). Here is the text that you need to read:

[B][I][U]QUOTE
31 The Jewish leaders didn't want the victims hanging there the next day, which was the Sabbath (and a very special Sabbath at that, because it was the Passover), so they asked Pilate to hasten their deaths by ordering that their legs be broken. Then their bodies could be taken down. 32 So the soldiers came and broke the legs of the two men crucified with Jesus. 33 But when they came to Jesus, they saw that he was dead already, so they didn't break his legs. 34 One of the soldiers, however, pierced his side with a spear, and blood and water flowed out. 35 This report is from an eyewitness giving an accurate account; it is presented so that you also can believe. 36 These things happened in fulfillment of the Scriptures that say, "Not one of his bones will be broken," 37 and "They will look on him whom they pierced."

UNQUOTE[/U][/I][/B]

I’m not talking about the Centurion and the spear, I am talking of Jesus knowing that his actions would inevitably lead to his death and continuing nevertheless.

He could be said to have chosen to die.

[quote=Nielo;106117]The Catholic Church was peddling heaven to it’s believers when life was miserable, brutish and short. In order to stop it’s followers choosing to go and join the heavenly choirs, they made suicide a sin.

It was not long ago that suicides could not be buried in consecrated ground. Then again eating meat on a Friday would consign you to everlasting torment too.

[B][I]CaroleB is right to point out that perhaps Jesus was the first assisted suicide, accepted by the church – his method is now known as suicide by cop.[/I][/B]

I thank Yoda that we live in more enlightened times and the poor parents of Daniel James are not to face prosecution. Is there really a God who could condemn either them or their son for making the decisions they did?

Of course laws must be in place to prevent anyone ever being pressurised to make the decision to end their life, but if that decision is made by a person who genuinely wants to die, I believe we must accept that decision and respect their wishes.[/quote]

This is what you said, Nielo. I cannot see anything about Jesus trying to commit suicide, which is going a bit too far. One thing is to upheld your ideas and another is to willingly kill yourself. Jesus knew that he was going to die but it was His enemies who killed him. At a certain moment, he even asked the Father to save him, but He accepted His superior Will.

As for the Catholic Church.... we used to be just one Church not that long ago and the position was the same for everyone. Actually, even non-Christian churches have similar views on euthanasia and suicide:

QUOTE:
"Taking one's own life is frowned upon in most societies, however when searching the Scriptures on the
ramifications of committing suicide, no passages can be found that specifically address this issue in

either an approving, or disapproving light. In fact, when studying the official positions held by various
churches on either suicide, physician-assisted suicide, or euthanasia, their reasoning for condemning
these practices are - not surprisingly - almost entirely based on philosophical views and opinions.

Many of these reflect the writings of St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, who were able to officiate
their own personal beliefs, rather than support them through scriptural accounts. Their positions were

adapted and upheld through the Middle Ages and the Reformation, and not only resulted in a denial of

Christian burial for those who had committed suicide, but also allowed the confiscation of their property,

and desecration of their bodies.

Historically however, suicide and assisted suicide (mercy killing) were commonly practiced to avoid

being tortured, abused, or being taken as slaves by the enemy.

The Roman historian Josephus Flavius recorded one account of mass suicide, where in AD 73, the

Romans besieged the desert fortress of Masada, trapping 967 Jewish men, women, and children,

who belonged to a group of rebels - or terrorists - known as the Sicarii.

Upon breaching their defenses, the Sicarii burned their belongings and either killed one another, or
committed suicide, rather than be captured alive. When the Romans reached the mountain top, they

were met with a multitude of the dead, save for two women and five children, who had hidden them-

selves, being the only survivors.

There was also the Hindu practice of "Sati" (or "Suttee"), where widows would commit suicide in their
husbands' funeral pyres, a deed regarded as honorable, while "Seppuku" (or "Hara-Kiri") is known as

a ritual and honorable suicide with the Japanese to atone for disgrace and defeat.

Even early Christianity celebrated virgins who preferred suicide to dishonor. Saint Pelagia, who feared

the loss of her chastity and jumped from a roof to escape a Roman soldier, was later canonized for her

suicide.

Today, both Judaism and Islam teach that human life is sacred and they forbid suicide and euthanasia
under any circumstances:

• Jewish Law (in summary) forbids euthanasia and regards it as murder. There are no exceptions

to this rule and it makes no difference if the person concerned wants to die. However if a patient is
certain to die, and is only being kept alive by a ventilator, it is permissible to switch off the ventilator

since it is impeding the natural process of death.

• Muslim Law (in summary) states that suicide and euthanasia are explicitly forbidden. All human
life is sacred because it is given by Allah, and Allah chooses how long each person will live. Human
beings should not interfere in this.

With the exception of the United Church, Methodist Church, and Unitarian Church, who to some extent
support the principle of assisted dying for the terminally ill, most other churches offer very similar views
against suicide, physician-assisted suicide, and euthanasia (mercy killing, or painless death), although
many have changed their official stand from a generally less liberal position they held centuries ago.

• The Evangelical Lutheran Church (1992), adopted the following "End of Life" decisions (in part):

"When medical judgment determines that artificially-administered nutrition and hydration will not
contribute to an improvement in the patient's underlying condition or prevent death from that
condition, patients or their legal spokespersons may consider them unduly burdensome treatment.
In these circumstances it may be morally responsible to withhold or withdraw them and allow death

to occur...

Because competent patients are the prime decision-makers, they may refuse treatment recom-

mended by health care professionals when they do not believe the benefits outweigh the risks and
burdens. This is also the case for patients who are incompetent, but who have identified their wishes

through advance directives, living wills, and/or conversation with family or designated surrogates...

Physicians and other health care professionals also have responsibility to relieve suffering. This

responsibility includes the aggressive management of pain, even when it may result in an earlier

death. However, the deliberate action of a physician to take the life of a patient, even when this is the
patient's wish, is a different matter. As a church we affirm that deliberately destroying life created in
the image of God is contrary to our Christian conscience...

We also recognize that responsible health care professionals struggle to choose the lesser evil in
ambiguous borderline situations -- for example, when pain becomes so unmanageable that life is
indistinguishable from torture.

(However) We oppose the legalization of physician-assisted death... suicide and euthanasia, ...and

to medical personnel having any part in actively inducing death, even at the patient's request or at

the request of the family..."

• The Catechism of the Catholic Church (2003) states (in part):

"All forms of suicide and euthanasia remain strictly prohibited, but questions of moral culpability

and eternal salvation are left open.

Discontinuing medical procedures that are burdensome, dangerous...or disproportionate to the
expected outcome can be legitimate... The decisions should be made by the patient if he is able

and competent or, if not, by those legally entitled to act for the patient...

Even if death is thought imminent, the ordinary care owed to a sick person cannot be legitimately
interrupted. The use of painkillers to alleviate the sufferings of the dying, even at the risk of
shortening their days, can be morally in conformity with human dignity if death is not willed as either

an end or a means, but only foreseen and tolerated as inevitable. Palliative care is a special form of

disinterested charity. As such it should be encouraged..."

• The Greek Orthodox Church states (in part) that it "is opposed to suicide in any form and regards

it as a grievous sin and has taught that we do not have the right to take our own lives, since life is a
gift from God which we are called upon to preserve and enhance. Hence, suicide is the most serious
kind of murder, because there is no opportunity for repentance.

Morally speaking, there is also the case of indirect suicide, in which people harm their health through
abusive practices such as excessive smoking, excessive drinking of alcoholic beverages, and
unnecessary risk-taking...However, they do not carry the same negative implications which the direct

taking of one's own life has.

The Orthodox Church firmly opposes euthanasia and regards it as "a form of suicide on the part of
the individual, and a form of murder on a part of others who assist in this practice, both of which are
seen as sins. The Church does not expect that excessive and heroic means must be used at all
costs to prolong dying, as has now become possible through technical medical advances..."

UNQUOTE

I think that this thread is just another one to add to the list of "Catholic Church Bashing" which seems to be a favourite topic.

Gala that is not why the thread was posted by me but see on reflection that perhaps you would see it as an attack on the Catholic Church and indeed on other faiths as you have said the concept of euthanasia is abhorrent to them too.

The subject is very pertinent at the moment because of Daniel James. I though it would be interesting to see the views of people here on a more personal direct level. I know if I was in severe physical pain I would want to end my life.

Hi

Gala I cannot reply in detail to your post but only know that I would not anyone I loved to die the way my mother did last year. She suffered extreme pain and distress, and unfortunately was conscious until the last hours. Had she been one her pet dogs she would have been helped leave this world with just a little dignity. In fact, had she been one her dogs and been allowed to suffer as she did then the owner would have been proscecuted for cruelty to animals - and rightly so!

My mother was a devout Christian, but I didn't see any sign of love for her from her saviour who allowed her to suffer such an appalling death.

Yes, some may say that we are not the same as other living creatures - we are higher beings, well I for one, do not accept this. Man is just another species, ok with a larger brain (used as often to cause harm as do good) and an opposable thumb. We are all part of a very fragile ecosystem, planet earth, where we came, we live and we will leave (or destroy/or be destroyed) as have countless other species throughout the millenia.

Dont get me wrong, I am enjoying life, but recognise that I have been born in a time and in a place where my quality of life is good, it wasn't always so. As for religion, yes we do need to believe in something greater than ourselves, this has always been so. A quick research will show ancient peoples for many thousands of years worshipped the natural world and held it in awe, we have moved on bit from that with our increased understanding of science.

However, religion is the cause of so much that is wrong in this world, Hindu, Jew, Muslim, Christian - Catholic, Protestant, take your pick - all will defend their beliefs to, in some instances, death.

Religion, yes I love the art etc. that devotion and benefactors produce, but in essence I believe that all religions are mechanisms to control populations. One only has to look at Islam and the treatment of women to understand this, and Gala even the Catholic church treats women differently from men. My mother, a member of the Church of England, had to undergo a 'cleansing ritual' after giving birth, because she was considered 'unclean' and was refused the sacrament until after this ceremony.

Gala, I dont think anyone here is intends to bash you or the Catholic church only put forward their own strongly held views.

[quote]I think that this thread is just another one to add to the list of "Catholic Church Bashing" which seems to be a favourite topic.
[/quote]

Gala, please don't take offence. You obviously have faith and believe in the teachings of the church, but many others do not.

As we have the freedom to belong to and believe in a religious creed we also have the freedom not to. If we do not believe in the teachings of the church and therefore do not believe that suicide or euthanasia is a sin, then we have the right to discuss it from a secular moral standpoint.

As a non-believer I don't see why the church should be able to dictate to my beliefs.

I would never push my beliefs onto others and would respect the beliefs of others but I also request that my beliefs be respected, even if not shared.

If we can accept and respect the fact that people believe in different things and can tolerate other religions and belief systems, then surely we must accept and respect the beliefs of a person who wishes to end their life?

[quoteEven early Christianity celebrated virgins who preferred suicide to dishonor. Saint Pelagia, who feared

the loss of her chastity and jumped from a roof to escape a Roman soldier, was later canonized for her

suicide.] [/quote]

This I am afraid is a perfect example of what made me question and subsequently loose what faith I had.

I can not believe in the teachings of a church with such double standards. That a young man, confined to a wheelchair and in constant pain is expected to get on and live whilst someone who commits suicide to avoid rape is called a saint goes against my fundamental beliefs.

I have no wish to diminish your belief but I would ask that you try to respect mine and accept that this subject can be discussed without it being deemed as ‘Catholic Church Bashing’.

The main reason that this subject is an issue of dicussion in Italy at the moment is the case of Iluana, a woman who has been in a coma for seventeen years.
Her parents finally persuaded the High Court that the doctors could be allowed to turn off the life support machine (having done all the normal medical tests demonstratng that her brain was not functioning at all).
The opposition from very religious people and politicians using religon as part of ther agenda stepped in, and the Pope (was reported as) suggesting that even the clnically braindead have a soul and therefore it would be murder.
So she still lingers on the machine. Yesterday, another woman who has been in a coma in a hospital for two years reportedly moved an arm, and this is being hailed as justification for keepng Illuana alive. I await a report from some extreme cleric calling it a miracle.
Why can't they just keep this stuff out of the papers, out of the courts, and get on doing (what to my eyes) is the obvious thing, on the quiet?

After I tried to clarify some points, which I thought that could be misleading, I am going to give you my personal opinion on this matter.
First of all, and as it was the start of the thread, I think that the Pope was just fulfilling his role when he made those comments about euthanasia. The Catholic Church and many other denominations are against it and they obviously have to defend their current position. But even their stance on paliative care has changed enormously over the last 30 years, so I would not be surprised if some day a more relaxed attitude is taken.
As for what I would do myself if I am ever in this kind of predicament, I simply do not know, as it would greatly depend on the particular circumstances. I hate the idea of having to make such a decision and I can only hope that paliative care will be available and would be the proper option.
I have seen a few people die, some better than others. Doctors and nurses have always helped me to take care of them in the best possible way and avoid unnecessary suffering. I know that this is not always possible and there are special cases and circumstances to which I do not know how I would react. I do not think that God wants us, or anyone else, to suffer and I am sure that, in His infinite mercy, He will understand anything we do out of love and in a selfless way. I also think that He has given us an intelligence to use in order to try to find ways and means to alleviate the suffering of others. This is a topic where we cannot simply choose between black or white, because there are many grey areas.

[quote=Gala Placidia;106131]After I tried to clarify some points, which I thought that could be misleading, I am going to give you my personal opinion on this matter.
First of all, and as it was the start of the thread, I think that the Pope was just fulfilling his role when he made those comments about euthanasia. The Catholic Church and many other denominations are against it and they obviously have to defend their current position. But even their stance on paliative care has changed enormously over the last 30 years, so I would not be surprised if some day a more relaxed attitude is taken.
As for what I would do myself if I am ever in this kind of predicament, I simply do not know, as it would greatly depend on the particular circumstances. I hate the idea of having to make such a decision and I can only hope that paliative care will be available and would be the proper option.
I have seen a few people die, some better than others. Doctors and nurses have always helped me to take care of them in the best possible way and avoid unnecessary suffering. I know that this is not always possible and there are special cases and circumstances to which I do not know how I would react. I do not think that God wants us, or anyone else, to suffer and I am sure that, in His infinite mercy, He will understand anything we do out of love and in a selfless way. I also think that He has given us an intelligence to use in order to try to find ways and means to alleviate the suffering of others. This is a topic where we cannot simply choose between black or white, because there are many grey areas.[/quote]

Gala,
Considering the strong belief you have in your church and it's teachings, which I really do respect, and the strength and clarity of your previous, long and detailed, response regarding the view taken on euthanasia, mercy killing etc. by various religeons - I really thought you were totally entrenched in Catholic dogma...

But this revelation of your personal feelings here is so gratifying to read... You obviously DO feel as many of us do (irrespective of which religion we may choose to follow - or not, as the case may be), that there can be no cut and dried RULE/LAW for such cases... every one must be decided on its own merits and on the wishes of the individual at the centre of the situation.

I too can accept that there is no black - or white, but instead so [I]many[/I] areas with varying shades of grey. I wonder how long world religions will take to come to a similar conclusion?

Not worth starting a new thread for this piece of news, but perhaps you have missed it and it is related to the general topic of our discussions:
[url=http://www.italymag.co.uk/italy/life-style/italians-take-personal-approach-catholicism]Italians take personal approach to Catholicism | Italy Magazine[/url]
As you will see, Italians, although deeply religious refuse to accept all of the teachings of the Catholic Church and prefer to make their own decisions. The same thing happens currently in Spain. But something I find worth mentioning is the interest amongst the younger generations in religion. I think that John Paul II had a lot to do with this.

Coming from a rather devout Catholic family myself, I would say that survey about sums it up for me today.
I consider myself 'staunch' in my faith but not in all the principles of the church.
I take what I believe to be suitible for me in this day and age and although I may not agree with many of the church dotrines, it does not really disturb me that they are there.
Unfortunately most religions are slow in keeping up with modern social progress.

[quote=Aretina;106126]Hi

Gala I cannot reply in detail to your post but only know that I would not anyone I loved to die the way my mother did last year. She suffered extreme pain and distress, and unfortunately was conscious until the last hours. Had she been one her pet dogs she would have been helped leave this world with just a little dignity. In fact, had she been one her dogs and been allowed to suffer as she did then the owner would have been proscecuted for cruelty to animals - and rightly so!

My mother was a devout Christian, but I didn't see any sign of love for her from her saviour who allowed her to suffer such an appalling death.

Yes, some may say that we are not the same as other living creatures - we are higher beings, well I for one, do not accept this. Man is just another species, ok with a larger brain (used as often to cause harm as do good) and an opposable thumb. We are all part of a very fragile ecosystem, planet earth, where we came, we live and we will leave (or destroy/or be destroyed) as have countless other species throughout the millenia.

Dont get me wrong, I am enjoying life, but recognise that I have been born in a time and in a place where my quality of life is good, it wasn't always so. As for religion, yes we do need to believe in something greater than ourselves, this has always been so. A quick research will show ancient peoples for many thousands of years worshipped the natural world and held it in awe, we have moved on bit from that with our increased understanding of science.

However, religion is the cause of so much that is wrong in this world, Hindu, Jew, Muslim, Christian - Catholic, Protestant, take your pick - all will defend their beliefs to, in some instances, death.

Religion, yes I love the art etc. that devotion and benefactors produce, but in essence I believe that all religions are mechanisms to control populations. One only has to look at Islam and the treatment of women to understand this, and Gala even the Catholic church treats women differently from men. My mother, a member of the Church of England, had to undergo a 'cleansing ritual' after giving birth, because she was considered 'unclean' and was refused the sacrament until after this ceremony.

Gala, I dont think anyone here is intends to bash you or the Catholic church only put forward their own strongly held views.[/quote]

Aretina, thank you for your post and sorry for the delay in answering it, but it was special and I did not want to answer in a rush.
First of all, I am very sorry to hear about your mother's experience. It must have been terrible for you. Perhaps, the clinic where she was had no experience on proper palliative care. Not every hospital applies it, most of the times because they do not have a palliative care team, which needs quite a few professionals working together and this is terrible. There are many ways to alleviate suffering and they should all be used. So it was all human fault that neither you, nor God could control. I believe that God has given us an intelligence capable of finding solutions to human suffering and that it is our duty to use it for that purpose. I am sure that your Mother will have now found peace and care that will compensate for those difficult times she had to go through.
As for the "superiority" of human beings, well, we can say that we have been specially gifted; however, we are all part of a Higher Plan which includes many creatures and species both great and small. What happens is that we have mostly used the "law of the jungle", the stronger against the weaker, and I do not think that God is particularly happy about what we have done.... or what we will keep on doing if something or someone does not stop us.
I agree that religions, in general, have not fulfilled the role that should have been expected from them; however, I think that they are made and ruled by human beings who make mistakes. Although I was born a Catholic and I will die still a Catholic I could be in a desert island, without a church, without a priest and my heart will still turn to God, because, really, He is all what I need.
As you say, religion has not been particularly kind to women. Again, it was the "law of the jungle" in action and it continues to be so. I don't care, I know that this was not in God's plans so it does not bother me. The only thing that I feel sorry about is for wasting such a lot of resources that women could bring to the world if they were allowed a more visible role. But there are quite a few who do it, particularly those missionary nuns who silently work for the poor, the sick, the unwanted in very many places of the world. They are the real heroines but very few know about them. And they are not trying to convert those people. I can remember a missionary nun I once met who was talking about their work in Africa and an old priest, with very conservative ideas asked her how was she succeeding in converting those children she was caring for. Her answer, was very interesting as she said: "Father, my priority is to make this child into a human being and preferably a good human being; then, if God hears my prayers, I may even be able to transform that good human being into a good Christian, and finally, if I am very very lucky, I may end up making that good Christian into a good Catholic, but this is not my priority, only the first one". The old priest had a shock but all the others applauded.
As for the purification ceremony that your mother went through, it was an old tradition inherited by all denominations from Judaism (which in turn picked it up from somebody else in the Middle East). It was traditional until some 40 years ago. It rememberd the ceremony that the Virgin Mary went through at the Temple after the Birth of Jesus. Nowadays, we only celebrate the Festivity of the Purification of the Virgin (or Candlemas) on the 2nd of February. As you see, even Religion has to adapt to modern times and it will gradually do so, getting rid of old customs and beliefs which are not relevant.
Lastly, I do believe that there is life after death and this was a belief that my late father, a devout Catholic but with larger views, passed on to me through his own experience. He was very seriously wounded during the Spanish Civil War and was dying at the makeshift operation room as there was no anesthesia, no basic medical drugs or equipment. He was in excruciating pain as he had lost one leg and the other one was practically hanging. We now know that his heart stopped twice during the procedure and he only wanted to die.... Well, apparently he did for a few minutes and he could vividly remember that he stopped suffering immediately and that he felt as if he was looking at the scene from above. He felt peace, serenity, love around him and he could see a light, as if it was at the end of a tunnel. It was like no other light he had ever seen before.... And then, he could not remember anything else as he was brought back to life. He used to talk about this well before all those reports about similar experiences started to appear in the press and he said that the experience was practically identical. He was no longer afraid of death, the only thing was that he asked God to take him quickly when He decided that his time was up as he reckoned he had already suffered enough the first time and throughout his time on Earth because of his injuries. Well, God granted his wish. He simply collapsed on Christmas Day 1979 after going to Mass and taking comunion, something he had not done for years as he was very angry with the Catholic Church for its position during the Spanish Civil War. He was smiling when he collapsed... I hope that this will help but it is very emotional for me....
Sorry, this is too long, but I thought that you would like to hear it. Forgive my mistakes as I don't feel like reading or correcting it.

Thank you for your last thoughts on this question Gala.

Oh - if only all exponents of all religions could approach diversity, as you have done here, I'm sure there would be far less turmoil around us in the World.

Carole, for some, unfortunately, Religion equals Power and this is the cause of all evil.I am a bit unorthodox in my beliefs, but I think that we all have just the one God under different representations conditioned by culture and circumstances. And I cannot say that one is better or worse than the others. I am a Catholic because I was brought up as one, but I do not believe that I am better than anyone or that all the others are wrong.