831 SWIFT payments

Were the funds transferred in sterling or euro ??????
The banks will charge for anything they can get away with, the competition between banks doesn't really exist here, they're all out to screw you as much as they can. Still love it though... :(

Banca Toscana suck IMO. They are the bank we use in Italy and over the years they have proved to be completely useless. Twelvee years after we opened the account they still treat every transaction with suspicion and have been unable to set up an RID (direct debit) to pay for water irrespective of how many clues they are given.

A few years ago they lost an extremely large transfer of money for over three months. At one point they were trying to deny that the money have ever been transferred from the UK, eventually it turned up in an account in Florence with no explanation for the foul up at all.

Most recently, they simple refused to pay our architect. We gave him the cheque and left Italy fro a trip to the UK only to get a plaintive call from him that the bank not only refused to pay him but also accused him of being a thief. When I called the bak to find out what had happened, they offered the excuses:

1. No money in account (untrue, there was enough money to pay his fee ten times over).

2. Signature did not match the one on file (untrue).

3. The bank had no warning that the payment was to be made (! I don't expect to have to call the bank for each and every transaction to warn them that someone will present a cheque in due course.)

4. The bank itself did not have enough money to honour the payment (that caused a panic, if they can't honour one cheque from one customer, what financial state are they in?)

5. They did not know our architect personally, so how could they pay him? (! I was astounded, does a bank seriously expect to know every person that I make payments to in person?)

Also I don't know if BaTo made the same promises to you that they did to us, but when we opened the account they said we would have a personal banker at tehir branch in London who would help with problems, not they said that any would ever occur (HA!) When our money went missing we tried to use this "personal banker" and had a real shock.

We called the number and someone announced the name of a different bank (Banca di Roma I think). I asked if I had called the wrong number and they hummed and muttered a bit and said no but "he" was not in the building at the moment. I asked what was going on and they said that the man from Banca Toscana rented a desk in another bank. But he was rarely if ever at his desk. Mostly he arrived late, took long lunches and went home early. He never saw clients at the office.

In four weeks of calling his number sometimes eight or more times a day, we could never get hold of him. In the end we only sorted things out by setting a lawyer onto them who threatened to denounce the bank to the Italian banking commission. We're looking to shift accounts but will ahve to pay fees to clsoe the account we have :mad:

A quick tour around the banks a couple of weeks ago revealed that the vast majority are just useless. Of all the ones we tried only Banca di Napoli and Banca di Roma could possibly be regarded as "banks" in any real sense. The others simply seem to be job attendance schemes for the lazy and the stupid.

Umm yes, I do fume more than just a bit about this. Much as I love Italy, I hate the damn banks.

You might want to look into using PayPal ([url]www.PayPal.com[/url]) as it's quick & seems a lot cheaper.

[QUOTE=lotaresco]Banca Toscana suck IMO. .[/QUOTE]

Phew! Your experience with Banca Toscana sounds terrible. I feel lucky that the money arrived at all. We are actually keeping our money in the UK in a Nationwide account and doing everything by Internet banking. As Nationwide don't charge for sterling to euro transactions and their exchange rate is good we'll stick with them rather than risk opening an Italian account and paying their ludicrous charges.

[QUOTE=tuscanhills]You might want to look into using PayPal ([url]www.PayPal.com[/url]) as it's quick & seems a lot cheaper..[/QUOTE]

I use Paypal all the time but the landlord has real problems with even a fax machine (he answers the damned thing eveytime it rings) and getting anything like a receipt out of him seems very difficult. The intricacies of Paypal would be impossible for him to understand - even if he had a computer. He's a farmer in his seventies who shoots small birds for pleasure and is, we are coming to realise, rather penny pinching.
As our Italian is bad and his English non existent we have to get an intermediary to explain everything.

[QUOTE=GeorgeS]Were the funds transferred in sterling or euro ??????
[/QUOTE]

In Euros. Approximately £36.00 for each Swift transfer seems exhorbitant to me.

Ho hum.

The bottle of wine Ive consumed this evening may have had the desired effect and maybe Im now talking rubbish but 24 euros isnt 36 quid is it??
I'd had thought is was about £18.
Still expensive though..
We have had some very positive experiences with Banca Carime (part of the BPU group) if anyone should be interested in hearing about them.
Ciao Brian & Lesley

[QUOTE=iwanttobeinitaly]The bottle of wine Ive consumed this evening may have had the desired effect and maybe Im now talking rubbish but 24 euros isnt 36 quid is it??
I'd had thought is was about £18.
[/QUOTE]

:)

I meant the €24.00 (£16.00 ish) paid in Italy to receive the money + the £20.00 paid in the UK to send it.

It seems that it's discretionary for the receiving bank to charge for Swilft transactions. Unsurprisingly, from what I read here, an Italian bank is likely to charge.

Thanks for the tip on Banca Carime.

I have heard that the Post Office is the best place to bank . We haven't tried it yet as we are still sorting things out and have a temporary bank account with Banca Intessa ( we are in Puglia) and so far haven't had any problems transfering funds from the UK. We also pay all large bills ( builders etc) by bankers draft ( we just pop in bank and they give us bank draft for what we want). We were told bank fees would be 20 euros every 2 months while we have account ...obviously not UK banking (free) but will let you know if things go wrong.

Apparantly the Post Office charge 30 Euros per annum but as I say I am only going on what I've been told, anyone out there got a Post Office account and can advise ? Also heard Post Office do a very good house insurance ?
Alex and Lyn

Down here in Abruzzo I use Banca Caripe and have had no problems whatsoever. Here is a list of points that may or may not be of interest:

1) When I first came out I transferred about £11,000 pounds from HSBC to my Banca Caripe account. I was charged £20 by HSBC and about E60 by Banca Caripe (I was in a hurry).

2) I recently helped some customers to move E31,000 from England to Italy. I asked my bank what the charges would be. They told me that the rules in Italy had just changed and that each transfer now attracts a fixed charge of only E3.50 They also said it was better to move the money in three lots so as not to exceed E11,500 - apparently that would have meant having to signal the transfer to the financial authorities. My clients used one of the many money mover companies in England and sure enough were charged E3.50 for each transaction and I think £10 per transaction in the UK.

3) All my standing orders are paid by RID free of charge.

4) If you need cash from the UK the Bancomat system is good. Using my Switch card I can draw £400 from any Banca Toscana Bancomat. The only charge is made by HSBC in the UK at 1.49% of the Sterling equivalent and so far the exchange has always been competitive.

5) My only grievance is that I have to pay E2/month for internet banking. Oh well!

Hope this helps....

You will find a Post Office account very convenient and inexpensive - I recommend it to you.

I made same research on Italian banks. I was so surprised to realise that Italian banks usually do not give on-line facilities to foreigners until they reach the Italian residence permit. The same is for the book cheque. However, I compared the conditions from several Italian banks offering services to foreigners. I believe that Unicredit Bank offers convenient options, with on-line banking, cheque book, credit card, debit card and all transactions included in a monthly flat rate.

[QUOTE=Cassini;4756]You will find a Post Office account very convenient and inexpensive - I recommend it to you.[/QUOTE]

I will be non-resident and would like to open a post office account, but understand that I would not qualify being non-resident do you know if this is correct ?

[QUOTE=Adrienne;5171]I made same research on Italian banks. I was so surprised to realise that Italian banks usually do not give on-line facilities to foreigners until they reach the Italian residence permit. The same is for the book cheque. However, I compared the conditions from several Italian banks offering services to foreigners. I believe that Unicredit Bank offers convenient options, with on-line banking, cheque book, credit card, debit card and all transactions included in a monthly flat rate.[/QUOTE]

Do you know what they charge to open, run and close account? I have been on the phone to all the banks - they just tell me to come in - I need to open a bank account in 1 day as a non-resident do you think that Unicredit will accept me then and any idea what they charge? Should I just open and close the account once my completion monies have been handed over or keep open and pay utilty bills via standing order but I thought may be I could do that with a post office account if non-residents qualify (I will always be a non-resident) for one that is and am unsure if my commune accept online payments. Any help would be gratefully received. I am unsure how I pay completion monies - do I sign the completion docs then go to the bank and ask for a banker's draft (I am not using a solicitor) - then return to the Notaio or get the cheque first, or do I pay via CHAPs from my Italian bank account - do the banks require much notice?

Anyone konw if the Notaio checks for any debts that may be inherited with the prpoerty or does only a solicitor do that as I understand UK solictors are more thorough and use more searches than the Notaio.

Thanks heaps if you can advise in any way

[QUOTE=Mary Ryan;53432]..... - I need to open a bank account in 1 day as a non-resident do you think that Unicredit will accept me then and any idea what they charge?

Should I just open and close the account once my completion monies have been handed over or keep open and pay utilty bills via standing order but I thought may be I could do that with a post office account if non-residents qualify (I will always be a non-resident) for one that is and am unsure if my commune accept online payments.

.... I am unsure how I pay completion monies - do I sign the completion docs then go to the bank and ask for a banker's draft (I am not using a solicitor) - then return to the Notaio or get the cheque first, or do I pay via CHAPs from my Italian bank account - do the banks require much notice?

....[/QUOTE]

I opened my bank account in approx 45 minutes [Banca pop. di Novara] - I went to Italy for one day only - met the estate agent - he took me to get the Codice Fiscale, then to Post Office to set up holding post in PO until my next visit, then to bank to set up account [as a non-resident] All very easy

Payment for house was by several Bankers draft [tax 'massaging' by vendors] - drafts were obtained before signing [again estate agent went with me and assisted - he knew what various drafts were required. Then straight to Notaio to sign everything off.

Later on [several weeks - estate agent helped set up direct debits for gas and electric [water paid by neighbour [joint supply in his name]

My advice - unless you speak Italian like a native - take someone with you who does.

I have already posted on this subject but at the risk of being a complete bore, I can't resist saying that when I closed my Banca Toscana account and opened a BancoPosta account, my quality of life improved dramatically! I now get a one-page monthly statement that I could understand even if I didn't read Italian, the fee is €30 per annum max, I pay bollettini, TV licence, phone recharges by online banking. I transfer money to Italian accounts (52cents) UK accounts (€1) New Zealand (€9.50) quickly and simply online. People transfer money to my account from the UK and US without problems (although the UK banks sting their customers to send the money). Funds arrive in four or five working days, although a couple of recent transactions have taken only 1 day. I have a Postamat card which I can use to withdraw up to €600 per day from Postamat machines and to pay for goods. I also have a prepaid Postepay card which you buy over the counter, top up by online transfer from your account, and can use it for online purchases as well as in shops.
There has been debate on the forum about whether residence is needed - I checked with my PO and they say no - just front up with your codice fiscale and passport.

Use one of the brokers like HIFX who give you a prime rate and the transfer from them is free.

Banks always charge for receipt but ours charges about 3 euro!

[QUOTE=Mary Ryan;53431]I will be non-resident and would like to open a post office account, but understand that I would not qualify being non-resident do you know if this is correct ?[/QUOTE]

Only just noticed this Mary. You do not need to be resident, just a codice fiscale and a passport. Just argue if they say no.

[QUOTE=Cassini;53892]Only just noticed this Mary. You do not need to be resident, just a codice fiscale and a passport. Just argue if they say no.[/QUOTE]

Thank you e tutti - I happened to write my code fiscale on a post-it note - BAD IDEA _ the post office refused me !! but the bank said YES ! and even though I had written the code incorrectly the bank managed to untangle the code !! Praise be the Lord - the Good Lord was looking down on me that day, will return to post office with the piece of A4 paper that my CF was printed on - as Embassy/Consulate did not send me it in a plastic card form just a piece of paper - Molto Importante - that piece of paper - not a post it note

[QUOTE=Mary Ryan;55770]Thank you e tutti - I happened to write my code fiscale on a post-it note - BAD IDEA _ the post office refused me !! but the bank said YES ! and even though I had written the code incorrectly the bank managed to untangle the code !! Praise be the Lord - the Good Lord was looking down on me that day, will return to post office with the piece of A4 paper that my CF was printed on - as Embassy/Consulate did not send me it in a plastic card form just a piece of paper - Molto Importante - that piece of paper - not a post it note[/QUOTE]

I've said this before, but it might be worth repeating. You don't need any piece of plastic or even an official form for the [I]Codice Fiscale[/I]. All you need is to know what it [U]is[/U], and you can do that very easily by going to a site such as [url=http://gratis.pietrelcinanet.com/codice_fiscale/codice.htm]Calcolo del codice fiscale[/url] and filling in the details ([U]all[/U] your Christian names, if you've got more than one, "Estero" and then "Gran Bretagna" for the [I]comune [/I]bit), then Calcola. The whole thing's automatically generated as a combination of - I think - the first so many consonants of your name (if there aren't enough, make up the number with vowels), the date when you were born, a letter for the month, the last two figures of the year in which you were born, and a code for your place of birth (e.g. Great Britain). The important thing is not to make a mistake, because if you write it wrongly on any document you'll having problems putting it right. In this case the post office presumably realised that the CF on your post-it was not possible, because, say, it was missing a letter for the month when you were born.

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