HABEMUS PAPAM FRANCISCUS!

76 years old - runner up in the last contest - nuff said

Not Francis 1, only Francis, until there is another.

it seems that a Christian has been elected, well the nearest thing to a Christian that we're going to get The Sun hasnt topped its Papa Razzi headline - we needed Pepsicola for that - but we have The Hand of God!  http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4840707/An-Argentinian-is-new-Pope-Francis-I-succeeding-Benedict-XVI.html

Rickardo, He is known as Franciscus I.  And he is a great man, extremely clever, but humble and compassionate. He is going to do great things. The name he has chosen because of both St Francis of Assisi and St Francis Xavier is a sign of change as he has broken with tradition. I have spoken with people who know him personally and we can expect quite a few changes.

Well Gala, all the media over here and the Cardinals on TV refered to him as just Papa Francesco (not the first or Franciscus as Rikardo says), so if you know better than them....?

Gala must be right, she is omniscient, I am only a humble human

Sorry, Flip, but that is not the case. If you look through media announcements, they use the two names, Pope Francis and Pope Francis I. As far as  know, the Vatican has not issued any rulings on the matter. Their Web page only shows a photograph and part of the traditional announcement "Habemus Papam Franciscus", which is then Followed by "Cardinalis Bergoglio, etc, etc". I do not have "privileged" information except for the fact that I do know people who personally know him and they have told me that he is a very humble person who dislikes pomp and ceremony. So we may end up calling him "Father Francis" and I am certain that he may prefer it... although the Vatican establishment may object...

'ROMA - Papa Francesco è arrivato pochi minuti dopo le 8 a Santa Maria Maggiore, una delle principali basiliche della capitale. Si è trattenuto in preghiera per circa mezz'ora. E' stata la prima uscita di Papa Bergoglio, avvenuta a distanza di sole poche ore dalla sua elezione.' This is just one article Gala (La Repubblica) and there are many more that refer to him as that (Francisus being Latin), so why don't you ask your buddies what he likes to be called as you're so chummy with them. He will be remembered as the first when he's gone and then only when another Francesco is appointed (same as happens in the  system of British Monarchy) so our Priest was saying today. What do Colonists know?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/shortcuts/2013/mar/14/pope-francis-who-look-like Now this is important - I personally plump for jim Bowen

Flip, Brits may do whatever they like, but I am pretty certain that the Vatican has not ruled on that. First, it is also usual to refer to Popes by their family names, i.e Pope Wotjyla (John Paul II), Pope Pacelli (Pius XII), and I can go on for ever. Second, I am almost certain that the late John Paul I was referred to in that manner during his short reign. Third Spain's current King is officially known as Juan Carlos I, and he is the first of his name. The same applied to French King François I. And there is also King Umberto Primo for Italy. I would confidently say that the Catholic Church will more likely follow the same customs adopted by other Latin countries instead of following British customs. So we shall see. No official announcement has been made.  

Right, Flip (I should start calling you Thomas), straight from the Vatican http://www.news.va/en/news/lombardi-mass-for-inauguration-of-petrine-ministry

Well, there seems to be a bit of confusion at the Vatican. Some of their news give the name as Pope Francis I; however, the latest form of address is "Santo Padre Francesco" (Holy Father Francis) which, in my opinion, is the way the Pope would prefer to be addressed, although I think he would personally prefer to be called plain Father Francis.nIn Argentina, even after been appointed as a cardinal, he always wanted to be called "Padre Jorge" (Father George). Jesuit priests are always called "padre", but I guess that conservative forces within the Vatican would not like that much familiarity....we shall see...

It is not possible that an Italian living in Italy could ever be right when Gala knows everyone, everywhere and has direct inroads and connections to the very top. Lord knows she probably Has his phone number, but lets hope she realises that everyone has His address!

Actually, I do have it, Karen; however, I refuse to share it with you and your fan club/alter egos. I do not want Him to be bothered with nuissance calls. End of the thread as far as I am concerned.  "Dominus vobiscum. Ite misa est"

You do not need a phone number to be in the presence of a Saint. This was a very unexpected experience whilst on holiday for myself and family.We were invited  to be in the presence of Saint Francis Xavier.

Thank you, Fillide.  I think that he will be a breath of fresh air in the Vatican. The only problem is that he is not very young and he may not have enough time to do everything he would like to do. He is a great man, very interested in the welfare of the poor, humble and very intelligent. He refused to live in the Archbishop's palace in BUenos Aires, never used official cars or had bodyguards, travelled by bus and subway to visit the "villas" or shanty towns and even now, on his first day in office, he refused to use the papal limousine. His choice of name reflects his philosophy and his admiration for two other "Franciscus", both Saint Francis of Assisi, the saint of the poor people and Saint Francis Xavier, a Jesuit missionary. We can expect great things from him, although he will not be as "colourful" as the Borgias, Borghese or Della Rovere popes. But there will be plenty of "plotting" in the Vatican. You can bet on that.

"Actually, I do have it, Karen; however, I refuse to share it with you and your fan club/alter egos. I do not want Him to be bothered with nuissance calls. End of the thread as far as I am concerned. "Dominus vobiscum. Ite misa est" You have what Maria?  Maria, are you saying you have the Lords phone number and would not share it?  It's OK Maria, do not fret, I already have His address and I'm almost sure He prefers a nice handwirtten letter anyway, but you are suggesting you are a good woman Maria, selfish and mean spirited acts are frowned upon and you'll never get into Heaven with so much hatred in your heart sweetie.  Breathe deeply and let all your guilt and frustration drain away, like a raging mountain torrent - or you will never release your soul from Purgatory. I forgive you Maria, go in peace Maria. Go in peace.

So 'we' have a new pope for 24 hours, and thus far its all been how very very 'umble he is.   Translate that into some action - such as give away some of the church's billions to the poor, and Ill believe he isnt just another hypocrite.  IN the meantime we have learnt he remained steadfastly silent during the fascist junta, and firmly believes the Falklands are Argentinian - so could well be responsible for a future war and hundreds of deaths of innocent men. Don'tyalove'em.... 

Ram, you really can't imagine what went on in Argentina during the Junta dictatorship. To say anything , even to complain, was the equivalent of signing your own death sentence. The Pope helped and begged authorities to release people. He has no crimes in his conscience. He went as far as hiding and giving a fugitive his own ID documents to help him scape. So the British press is wrong in trying to implicate him in anything like that. As for the Malvinas/Falkland, you have the British point of view. THe large majority of Argentinians will maintain that the Malvinas are Argentinian and that is not going to change. Check the history of the islands and most of us will agree that they are an anachronic colony in the South Atlantic which are located on the Argentinian continental shelf. And in order to occupy the territory by force, the British had to displace a very small Argentinian garrison that was already on the Islands. That happened back in 1833. Then, the British government proceeded to introduce population in the area that had no natives. There had only been small settlements of French fishermen from St Malo (Malouins, hence the name Malvinas), Spaniards and the last Argentine garrison. And they did not grant full British nationality to those born in the islands until after the Falklands/Malvinas war. And in case you had any doubts, I do not condone the Argentine invasion of the Islands. This was a crazy plan by the military Junta which only caused harm and deaths. Many young Argentinians, who were conscripted, found themselves fighting an impossible war, ill-prepared, abandoned by their own officers, dying not only by bullets but also because of the extreme conditions and hunger. It was un unforgivable horror caused by coward fascist dictators. The new Pope is a man of peace and humility. No warlord. No Julius II. Rest assured of that. P.S. Sorry, I had problems writing my original message with a tablet and had to correct some mistakes. Also, I wanted to add that anyone wanting to know more about the Jesuits and their work in South America should watch a movie called "The Mission", winner of multiple prizes and awards and with actors such as De Niro and Irons. The music by Ennio Morricone is heavenly. And it is a film based on facts, not fiction. Actually, Father Julian who is thrown from the top of the Iguazú falls to his death was the brother of one of my ancestors and he did exist. He was Father Julián de Lizardi, SJ, the protomartyr or first martyr of Paraguay. He was not thrown down the falls, this was done as it looked much better on the movie, but was killed by a rebel group of Indians while celebrating Mass with the Indians of his mission. In a way, much like the last scene where Father Gabriel dies. I strongly recommend you to watch it.

It's only fair to point out that it is a Souht American Nobel prize winner that points the finger at the Pope for effectively handing over priests to the fascist junta.  And no, i have no idea what went on, but I thought the point of being a devout Christian was to stick up for whats right - see martyrs.   I dont have any point of view on the Falklands/malvinas  but siding with the potty president of Argentina over who they belong to (is it any business of the Church?) will just inflame the current controversy, and lead to another futile invasion, when the residents have voted by 99.7% to remain British.  I know its all about oil and sidtracking public interest in things that really matter, but for a priest/cardinal/Pope to inflame an already dangerous argument is irresponsible.  I saw the mission - nice music.  I dont doubt he is a devout Jesuit and has taken his vows of poverty, chastity and obedience - so lets hope he makes the rest of the Vatican do the same - ethically and morally however he seems defiantly stuck in the 15 century - if the best he can offer is deigning to baptise illegitimate babies, he still has a long way to go to become what Jesus taught was a christian. 

I see no need for a Pope, not now we have Gala, who knows everything and everyone and is so humble and Christ like. Makes lies like a Christian too "end of the thread as far as I'm concerned" but then continues. shall you be Pope Maria or Pope Maria 1 ?

I keep seeing this thread bumped to the top so thought there may be something interesting in it. Wrong again! I wonder who really cares about this stuff - I only ever see very old ladies going to Mass in my village and surely all this out-of-date nonsense is why the various Christian sects are haemorrhaging support while watching Islam go from strength to strength. 

I think It's about time that Gala started her own forum, where she can 'agree/disapprove/condone/admonish/lecture/pontificate with whoever she wishes. It seems 'she' is the only one who is right, has the correct insight, knows everyone in a position of influence; in fact is so up herself that she rides roughshod over every other members views or opinions.  In my opinion, Gala, you are a very insecure (constantly referring to Bogeyman Sects who are out to disrupt 'Your' Forum) opinionated woman who should be pitied, who feels the need to be seen as the only person to have a correct perspective.

Ram. this is the latest on those rumours and I do believe that the Vatican version is correct http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21802684 Even Argentine Nobel Prize Pérez Esquivel has agreed that the current Pope had done everything in his power and under very difficult circumstances. You had to live in Argentina at the time to realize what a terrible situation they had to endure. Also, the Peronist government does not like Cardinal Bergoglio and is certainly behind some of the nasty comments and rumours. They usually do that. Quite a challenging country for anyone. I lived there for quite a few years although I left in 1973 when the real trouble had not started. I still have plenty of friends there. Sir TK, we are 1,200,000,000 Catholics around the world within a figure of over 1,500,000,000 Christians. We can't be that wrong! I am not going to convince you, but you are not going to convince me. On the other hand, and as it is the case with you, I also worry about the growth of the Muslim followers, but not the tolent ones but the fundamentalists. Nothing wrong with any religion, fanatism and power struggle are the real enemies. Flip, you are not worth an answer, but let me remind you that both yourself, Karen and your group have had their membership cancelled several times, both here and in the Old Forum. You had your own Forum and you lost it. Then, you came here to start again to annoy and cause disturbance. All those of us who know your animosity against this Community and the old Forum, and there are many of us, are sick and tired of you. And you systematically blame others for the sins you commit regularly. In the old Forum, we all know who was your victim. She is no longer here, so you have to find a new victim and you want me to take her place. Sorry, you are not going to move me one inch. Say whatever you want, I could not care less. So why don't you pack up and go. Create your own Forum and all the trolls can meet there. I promise you I will not join.

Who is this " Pope Francis" mentioned in the link you post Gala? They not refer to Francis 1 and therefore they must be wrong. Did not the Vatican also deny the child sex abuse scandal for many, many years? Is it too much for you to admit that you may not be always right?

Gala I have never been a member (which I have stressed before) of the 'Old' Forum (or another Forum to which you allude to regularly), Admin can confirm this if you ask; but this is precisely what I'm talking about, yet again you make wild accusations, which I am quite frankly sick of, against someone who YOU dislike and does not toady to you. Your xenophobic, reaction to what I say, is frankly appalling, yet you continue to deride myself and any others who hold opposing views; I for one am fed up with your Fascist outbursts.

P.S. Gala please change that awful avatar of yourself, it reminds me of a bulldog licking pee of a nettle.......

Well said Steve, and thank you Gala for reminding me of "the Mission"an amazing film, which I have seen twice.And thank you as ever for your contributions to the forum, we must be founder members by now.

Thank you, Angie. It is a fabulous movie and a source of inspiration. And Morricone's music is magnificent. For those still in doubt about the name adopted by  the new Pope, the Vatican, through Father Lombardi has clarified the matter http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/03/13/174237155/pope-francis-a-... The Pope himself has decided to drop the numeral and this goes along with his humble approach in everything he does. Also, besides adopting the name of Francis because of Saint Francis of Assisi, most unusual as Jesuits and Franciscans do not see eye to eye, I am sure that he also thought at two other Jesuit saints who had that name, Saint Francis Xavier and also Saint Francis Borgia (yes, a grandson of Pope Alexander VI and member of the notorious family). Google his biography and I am sure that you will find that it is not such a wild guess.  P.S. Thank you, Steve.

"Sir TK, we are 1,200,000,000 Catholics around the world within a figure of over 1,500,000,000 Christians. We can't be that wrong! ". Numbers are by no means all. Most claim a total of 2.5 billion christians which is a bit more than your 1.5bn, and the 1.2bn catholics is what the vatican claim, so not in the least trustworthy. Point I make is that catholicism is massive in the 3rd world where they don't know any better, or maybe just have not educated themselves out of it yet, but even so is losing support as we speak while Islam massively gains support. Personally I don't give a "solid-waste-product" which religion does what, unless world power is vested in religious groups, in which case I care dearly for my own safety. And what I see is that the 3rd world, supported by some old ladies with cats, are no match for the hue and cry of the Islamists. So I worry.

"Flip, you are not worth an answer, but let me remind you that both yourself, Karen and your group have had their membership cancelled several times, both here and in the Old Forum. You had your own Forum and you lost it. Then, you came here to start again to annoy and cause disturbance. All those of us who know your animosity against this Community and the old Forum, and there are many of us, are sick and tired of you. And you systematically blame others for the sins you commit regularly. In the old Forum, we all know who was your victim. She is no longer here, so you have to find a new victim and you want me to take her place. Sorry, you are not going to move me one inch. Say whatever you want, I could not care less. So why don't you pack up and go. Create your own Forum and all the trolls can meet there. I promise you I will not join." QED!! Hang on just a minute Maria, take a quick look in the mirror and you will see your Halo has slipped somewhat. It may be the very thing that eventually strangles you. (We will pray for you when it does.)

Just a polite request - could I ask that any personal squabbles be done by personal message rather than in the forum, otherwise we might think the squabblers are only trying to impress the rest of us, rather than just squabble with each other. Which they aren't. And that includes both sides of the squabbling.

SirTK, have you thought at another possibility? Perhaps Catholicism is gaining more adepts in the Third World because the Catholic Church is the only one that cares for them? And this includes education and health. Perhaps this may also be the reason why most of the new vocations originate there. In any case, the current Pope is a good example of someone who really cares for the poor. The Catholic Church is also the largest provider of health services in the world. Many Third World people depend on that care.

I am sorry to interrupt the war, but does that mean that I was actually correct when I said he is pope Francis, not pope Francis 1 and that Gala was wrong ?

The Catholic Church is also the largest provider of health services in the world. Many Third World people depend on that care. -  Thanks Gaia for that - of course this will be the Catholic health service such as the catholic hospital in America who decided that as foetuses 'werent human beings' they werent covered by health insurance.   (February 2013) hypocrites all. 

Sorry, Ram, but you are not telling the whole story. Although the lawyers used that argument, the Catholic Church immediately reacted stating that what the lawyers said was "moraly wrong". The Church cannot control what lay lawyers may say in order to win a court case; however, they quicly reacting condemning it. The Church is made of human beings and we do not really know whether those lawyers were practising Catholics or not. In any case, they did not have the approval from the Church to make such a statement, which is contrary to its teachings.

And the priests don't have approval from the Church to fiddle with small boys but it does seem to happen quite a lot. I guess you needed to be heartily brainwashed from birth in order to have blind faith in them. That, they are good at. 

SirTK, without trying to excuse the actions of the small percentage of paedophile priests in the Catholic Church, I invite you to have a look at some statistics on child sexual abuse http://womensissues.about.com/od/girlsteensyoungwomen/a/10-Facts-About-C... It is relevant to realize that the majority of child abuse cases occur in their own homes and it is perpetrated by parents and family members or minors under the age of 18. It would also be important to point out that the Catholic Church, or any other Church or Educational Institution does not condone or encourage this despicable behaviour. On the other hand, paedophiles seem to try to hide under the umbrella of these institutions as they provide easy targets for them because of the abundance of children and adolescents. It has also been pointed out that the percentage of paedophiles in the Catholic Church is not higher than what you will find in other churches, schools, sport clubs or anywhere these people will find easy targets. Yes, the Church was slow in reacting when accusations started and they should have done things in a different way. Mistakes were made; however, attitudes have changed and every effort is being made so that all this will not happen again.  Brain-washing can only be successful amongst uneducated people. And that applies to any type of brain-washing, whether political, religious or any other kind. If the person is educated and well-informed, brain-washing is not effective. There is a tendency nowadays to look at headlines and forget about contents. This is what keeps journalists and the media busy and wealthy. Headlines really sell and scandal is the best headline. The priest or nun who silently works in hospitals, missions, schools, welfare agencies will not get a headline and they are the large majority. I also think that this thread has already attracted too many questions and answers and replies that had very little to do with its title. A discussion about Religion should be the topic for another thread; however, I would be reluctant to start it. As far as I am concerned, this thread is finished. And this is final, at least for myself.

Give up guys, you must know by now that Gala always has the last word and of course is always correct. LMFAO.

I aint standing up for Maria/Gala - Lord know I have had a belly full of her at times, but I do know her faith is important to her and I think we all should respect that. Everything else is fair game.

But Gala said the thread had ended, for her, before but still she comes back! She knows the Pope personally but knows not what is his name! She will never admit to being wrong and if you disagree with her you are part of some conspiracy. hi Flip and Esme, I disagree with Gala, can I please be in your gang? She has already put me there. I wouldn't ever want to be in the same gang as  people with no brain of their own Who post only to bottom lick, like some of the sycophants here:)

"Brain-washing can only be successful amongst uneducated people" Which is exactly why they start the process at birth - babies are, by definition, uneducated. Not just catholics, all theists rely on it. Also the 3rd world is generally relatively uneducated. Old ladies with cats are not so easily defined, though the word "naive" tends to raise its head. All of which ties in with who the majority of the followers of catholicism are, in today's world. And why the sect will eventually fail in the face of other, more aggressive religious groups. 

Ric, Maria gets uptight at times, she has limited control when she see Flip or I involved in a thread and her bile rises - no matter what subject - until she almost chokes.  We pray for her. D'ya wanna be in my gang.. my gang.. my gang?  'Cus if ya do, then ya need to know you will be excommunicated from the Ave Maria choir and tossed into the playpen forever.

Very nice to see that the young people were out in force to see Pope Francis just as they are the overwhelming majority of people for the Sunday Mass.  Appears to be a decent person and I wish him well.

I hardly ever check this forum these days, but I much enjoyed this hilarious thread. Such a thrill knowing that I was in the virtual presence of someone who knows someone who knows someone who knows the Holy Father's personal phone number and can therefore speak on his behalf. As for the new Pope's age, I don't see that as a problem. He's two and a half months younger than Silvio Berlusconi and Berlo is obviously still at the peak of his game. I am, however, much amused by the official line that Bergoglio is such a humble chap. Surely, if he was all that humble, he would still be a priest serving a little flock somewhere in the Buenos Aires slums. Heaven knows there's no shortage of people there who need all the spiritual and physical help they can get just to make it through today. I'm pretty sure that, just as nobody is ever forced to become a President, Prime Minister or CEO of a multinational company, so the Catholic Church doesn't force priests to become archbishops, cardinals or the Pope. Therefore, it seems evident that this man is anything but humble; he has clearly felt for some time confident that his proper role is a much larger one than that of a mere priest. Ministers of religion who enjoy a lifestyle like that of a business executive or medieval prince thanks to the widow's mite are disgusting, but I find ostentatious humility and self-denial just as disturbing. It leaves me wondering if what's really going on might not be penance for secret sins. Apologists have sprung to the defence of Francis when questions have been raised about his actions (or inaction, rather) during the military dictatorship in Argentina. I'm not sure that, had I lived in such times, I would have willingly stuck my head in a noose on a matter of principle, but then I've never professed to be a Man of God. It's clear that there were those in the Church in Chile who were actively involved in opposing the military dictatorship in that country at around the same time and there were admirable souls who did the same in Hitler's Germany and Stalin's Russia, so it's not like he was without role models if he wanted them. I am left wondering why there isn't more definite evidence of Bergoglio having worked for the good of the common people, rather than tacitly supporting the military which was "disappearing" those whose main interest was assisting the poor and downtrodden. Finally, I look forward to seeing how this humble man manages to square his loudly proclaimed belief in the human rights of ordinary people with his support for Argentina evicting a couple thousand ordinary people from homes and farms their families have occupied for generations.

Al, I don't suppose ya wanna be in my gang... my gang.. my gang?  I think Santa Gala has deigned no further response  - stranger things (including miracles) have happened though.  Off to pray for my soul...