10437 Late ICI Payment calculation

Generally, the ones who calculate the ICI are either the "geometra" or the "commercialista".

[quote=Musetta;97146].......Does anyone know what the late payment fee/penalty would be or where I can calculate it?.......[/quote]

Get someone to pop into the Commune - when I was late [my holiday visits didn't coincide with bill being delivered] I went and asked and they did the calculations.

[As I was only a few days late - they waived any surcharge - but you can't rely on that]

.

Yep Commune.

Hi

As I understand it from my commercialista there was NO, repeat NO ICI this year. I have no idea why, we paid our income tax as per normal but he said ICI had been scrapped ? just for this year. (we normally pay them both together).

Looks like a bit of left/right politics to me.

[quote=Aretina;97171]Hi

As I understand it from my commercialista there was NO, repeat NO ICI this year. I have no idea why, we paid our income tax as per normal but he said ICI had been scrapped ? just for this year. (we normally pay them both together).

Looks like a bit of left/right politics to me.[/quote]

We heard that too along with car tax.I thought it may just be a Sardinian thing.

Hi PAS55

Haven't heard about the car tax, think that's still in force. Also the last car tax we paid was according to engine size/horse power etc. also eurozone categories for pollution. So the more polluting the car the higher the tax.

Think there is some regional variation here... Tuscany rate different from others but dont know if higher or lower. Perhaps others have more info.

ICI has been abolished if you are resident and you only own 1 house, if you have a holiday home you will have to pay, but a few months late should not cause any problems, just go to the commune when you are next in Italy.

We always go via the commune & the fee is (relatively speaking) peanuts.....don't use any middle-men/women

[quote=herealready;97176]ICI has been abolished if you are resident and you only own 1 house, if you have a holiday home you will have to pay, but a few months late should not cause any problems, just go to the commune when you are next in Italy.[/quote]
That's absolutely correct advice and this year the whole ICI business was such a mess the right hand did not know what the left was doing. So do send someone to the comune saying it was all a confusion and I expect you'll miss the small fine. Before this ICI change you would have been fined for being even one day late in our comune Passignano sul Trasimeno. We were 2 days late and a year later received a bill for about 15 euros fine. So remember the pay by dates 16 June and 16th Dec. If you are non resident, you must pay and if you are resident with more than one house you must pay too.

Our geometra makes the yearly calculation, takes it to our local bank that has our authority to make payments and they sort out the whole thing without us having to worry, whether we are there or not at the time of payment. All fully organised and I think the small fee for the service is well deserved. We save a lot on Aspirin!!!

In our comune that's the easy one. Just go in, they work it out and I can even pay by visa - chip and pin!!!

Hi Coppicer - that's sounds brilliant, which comune is that?

wow - impressive comune :-)

Gala Placidia - I have just gone into the post office, asked for a ICI form and filled it out - there was really no need to hire an comercialista to figure a small yearly payment that is easily calculated with published rates. I paid at the PO and then brought the receipt over to the comune tax office, where they filed it and gave me a copy for my records. My fee to the comercialista would have been much larger than the ICI and, like I said - it is very simple to figure.

However...this year, I was not over in June and asked a friend to drop off the payment at the Post Office and was told no more ICI - I knew that yes, there was indeed still ICI for non-residents, but the clerks disagreed....and I have not been able to be over to sort it out yet (so...guess...not so long a story)

Good advice though - I will pop into the Tax office at the comune and just ask for help. (and will just keep fingers crossed that any fees aren't adding up TOO much before I get there!)

Thank you all for the advice.

Last year found out we were late paying our ICI and that there would be a fine. Hot footed it around to local commune where we paid our ICI plus 6 months overdue fine.....fine E1!
I agree that paying yourself at the commune saves using the middle men, and it's no trouble.You get to know the folk at the commune in case you need help in the future. They are very helpful.
Sprat

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]Hi Romano

We live in the comune of Licciana Nardi - very 19th century in some things but they certainly make paying ICI for non residents easy - even with my very limited Italian :yes:[/FONT]

Thanks for that - we pay ours to Fivizzano, so will have to check out next time we are over. Currently, we just work out the figures and pay at the post office - never use an intermediary - which is no hassle, providing we're around when it's due.

We puzzingly had our ICI worked out by a trade union at no charge???? Our Italian was very limited at the time and I was sure I had misunderstood when they sent us there. However, being a hopelessly disorganised person, I'm pretty certain I'm now about 2 years behind on payments. Have never received any demands or bills in any form and am still quite baffled by it all. I'm not even sure how much I'm behind by.

How refreshing Heiko... we're now about 3 years behind on ICI, never get a bill, and my neighbours just tell us not to bother.

wow. ok. my three months seem like nothing now! Thanks for making me feel better! (BTW, we never receive a bill from the comune - no one does as far as know, so I'm assuming it differs from place to place - we are just supposed to go and pay in June and Dec We do, however receive an actual bill in the post for the rubbish tax...which is odd - you'd think they would send both or none.)

It is unusual for the comune to send out an ICI bill, although from reading comments on this site clearly some comuni do this (very sensible). However, the comune will shrug their shoulders and say 'non lo so' if you are sufficiently aware that (probably) you should also be paying IRPEF.

An interesting read...I do wonder what happens now regarding fines, now that most people do not have to pay ICI? Our Comune Passignano sul Trasimeno certainly made it worth their while to fine us. From memory it was about 15 euros. As I previously said we were a few days late, almost a year later a man with a white Fiat Panda stood at our gate and asked if we lived here, checked his clip board and within a month we received the fine! Quite possibly in some Comune's such things take years to be processed but the harder up the Comunes' get the more they will persue debtors I think.

[quote=Noble;97338]An interesting read...I do wonder what happens now regarding fines, now that most people do not have to pay ICI? Our Comune Passignano sul Trasimeno certainly made it worth their while to fine us. From memory it was about 15 euros. As I previously said we were a few days late, almost a year later a man with a white Fiat Panda stood at our gate and asked if we lived here, checked his clip board and within a month we received the fine! Quite possibly in some Comune's such things take years to be processed but the harder up the Comunes' get the more they will persue debtors I think.[/quote]
Hi Noble.....
Your post is quite disturbing. We were late paying our fine as mentioned in this thread, and the fine was E1.....does this mean we will get a man in a white Panda and a clip board visiting us with a much heftier fine?
We will also be able to fill you in on late paying of the ICI, as again we have not managed to pay on time and we are not resident....Ho hum
Sprat

We were totally amazed as from memory we were but 2 days late in paying and the collection took place about 10 months later!!! We advised friends who have holiday houses in our Comune and wish to "do it themselves" to make friends with the official at the Comune office. Some have been fined but lesser amounts, despite longer periods of delayed payments. Many people pay about 20 euros a year to get a bookkeeper to do it for them and yes there is the Workers Union that will help too.

Following total renovation I moved into my place in May 2005. My geometra had dealt with all the technicalities with the comune, including such things as ICI - which I had paid via him until I got my residency.

I then continued to pay my ICI quota when the comune sent me the details with their 'bollettino'. I do this through my bank.

Then in January [U]THIS[/U] year I got a 'Registered' letter from the Comune asking me to attend their offices (within 30 days) [I]to discuss the [U]underpayment[/U] of my ICI since June 2004[/I] (the date I purchased the house).

I went immediately and was asked to wait in a small office - not the usual public room with 'sportelli' where [I]everyone[/I] goes to do [I]everything[/I]! Well now, of course, alarm bells are ringing... will they arrest me? Will I be locked up, deported - what? I know from experience that you only need the [I]wrong[/I] "Jobsworth" in the [I]wrong [/I]job and anything can happen in Italy!

I didn't have to wait long and the Tecnical Officer arrived with 'my file' :eeeek:- turned on the computer and printed out a list of the ICI that I [U]had[/U] paid to date... He then explained that my property has 'X' sqm listed as habitable, and 'X' sqm listed as 'edificabile'. I was asked if I realised that? Rapid nod of head confirmed that i did...

He then went on to explain that my geometra had not included the 'edificabile' total when he made the declaration for the first time and that because of that I had [B][I]'avoided'[/I][/B] (his word) payment of the full total of ICI due on my property for a total of 43 months.... (that's it, I thought..nothing less than bancruptcy or deportation now)! He asked if I was aware that non payment also attracts a fine. I gulped and said I didn't :no: ([U]never[/U] admit that you know such things)!

He then explained that a re-calculation would be made and the difference between what I had paid so far, and what I [I]should[/I] have paid, would be added to the fine and I would be notified 'in due course'.

The 'in due course' turned out to be four months (huge calculation to be done) and another 'Registered' letter arrived with the outstanding amount and instructions that it should be paid, without fail, within 7 working days.

I owed them €28 for 43 months unpaid ICI and a fine for non payment of €11.
[B]Total debt: €39! [/B]

So don't get too uptight about your ICI payments....

....and if all else fails and you are female...start crying...works every time even with the hardest of bureaucratic hearts!!

[quote=Noble;97497]....and if all else fails and you are female...start crying...works every time even with the hardest of bureaucratic hearts!![/quote]

So [I][U]VERY[/U][/I] true! :yes:

I finally decided to see what the damage might be... used the ici calculator here: [url=http://www.dossier.net/guida/calcola.htm]Calcolo automatico dell'Ici - Imposta comunale immobili[/url] following the expatsinitaly website advice and got a negative number where my importo accounto was displayed! I used the rendita catastale from our origional purchase contract. Have the rendita catastale gone up since 2005?