10724 Living in Italy - it works!!!

I could have put this in my three favourite things about Italy but felt it deserved a thread on its own especially after the PN 'threads' (why did so many of us feel we just had to respond...I have a thought or two but probably best not aired here).

I have just experienced the best form of Italian pragmatism.:yes::yes:

We arrived in Sept 2003, got our permessi, were given residency, got our health cover via the E106 which rightly or wrongly gave us five years cover:smile:

However, our residency was not confirmed until Dec 2003 so our health cover expires two months before we are eligible for permanent residence and therefore automatic health cover. So what did the lovely Italian USL (local health office) woman do - she gave us another card which is valid until the end of the year to cover the intervening period. No hassle or stress. :smile:

For others interested in coming to Italy, dont be put off, do your research and make sure you have adequate funds to cope when things dont go according to plan.

As for gettng a codice fiscale - this has to be the easiest - The Italian government will fall over backwards to give you one. This is the way and it seems the only way the government can keep a track on its citizens. You definitely need it to buy a mobile phone, etc. but last week had to give it when took our dog to the vet! That was a first.

Category
General chat about Italy

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 04:45

Oh there's no doubt about it... things can go awry, but with a bit of patience, a 'smidgin' of frustration, a few cusses (under your breath), most things [I]can[/I] be sorted out. The secret is (IMHO) to [I][U]forget[/U][/I] how most things worked 'back there' (wherever 'there' may be), and accept that the culture here is [I]totally different! [/I]Now if you can accept that, then you're 90% on the way to making yourself a very happy life here.

As an example of just how frustrating 'officialdom' can be here, especially when you have a real 22carat "Jobsworth" mixed up in anything - here is one of [I]my[/I] experiences... it [U]IS[/U] long and for that I apologise... But of course you CAN put it on your ignore list I s'pose and not read it! :yes:

[B]"They're Coming to Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa "[/B]
Mad? MAD....? Too blo*dy right I'm mad!

It's Tuesday 20th June and I've just spent the best part of the day running around like the proverbial 'blue ar*ed fly'! If you're sitting comfortably (and can be bothered to listen), here's how the day went.

At 0815, 'bright eyed and bushy tailed' - I arrived at my Doctors surgery for prescriptions for my 'sweetie supply' ! I'm first, which is nice - no waiting... then after the 'niceties' she hit me with this - "Sorry, but ASL (like the NHS) at Lecco has [I]removed[/I] you from my patient list"! :eeeek:

I 'kid you not' - I nearly had another blo*dy heart attack! I had applied to retain her as my doctor when I finally moved my residence from the Province of Lecco to that of Sondrio (in my case a huge distance of 1.5 miles away - but nevertheless in [I]another[/I] Province).

All the 'request' paperwork was completed and deposited at the Sondrio - ASL office in March. It then had to be adjudged by their Medical Council for approval or rejection. (They would have to pay LC - ASL for my doctors services). I was sent a copy of their 'favourable decision' made on the 13th April. It was dated 5th May - (well we ARE in Italy you know!!!!). I mentioned this to my doctor at the time and she said "Great - we'll just carry on as normal then...."
Little did we know!

So on Tuesday she is informed of my removal - so in effect I now have NO doctor.... What to do? First stop - local ASL office in Colico... "No" they say "you should still be with your Doctor. Phone [U]THIS[/U] number at the Lecco ASL and tell them you have the agreement letter".
"Can't you phone them"? I ask stupidly.... "No - you don't show on our computer any more!"

Told you it was fun :yes:… By now I'm getting very near to being 'carted off' to the funny farm.

So, back home to speak to the [I]slowest, most stupid[/I] clerk that the Good Lord put on this earth! Don't they teach their clerks to let the customer explain the problem first - and THEN try and solve it for them???? He interrupted me throughout, to such an extent that I just stopped talking. It suddenly dawned on him that he was listening to his own voice and said "Are you still there"? :rollingeyes:

"Oh yes" say I..."I was just waiting for you to stop interrupting me by telling me that the problem was mine for NOT following 'the guidelines'. So WHAT must I do now to get my doctor back and some medicines before I have another heart attack"?
As you may well imagine - by now smoke is coming out of my ears! I can hardly even 'think straight'.

[COLOR="YellowRed"][B]They're Coming to Take Me Away, Ha-Haaa .... They're Coming to Take Me Away.[/B] [/COLOR] I just know it!

No - wait. It gets better.
"You'll have to go to ASL at Sondrio and tell them that they should have asked us FIRST (?)"
Do I detect that his feelings have been hurt? Bless… Well I blo*dy hope so!

So before setting out for Sondrio, I chance phoning the office where I made the original request in Morbegno.... where a [I]'delightful lady'[/I] listened to the problem, said she remembered me and that the OK from the Lecco Medical Council had arrived in their office [U]THAT MORNING![/U] Just come over, see me and I'll organise everything straight away"......she says!
I can't believe it - in the midst of all this chaos I had found some 'Efficiency' and someone who listens!!

Well within 20 minutes I'm at her 'sportello' (window) and she tells me that [I]'Sig. Impiegato Stupido'[/I] (her words...) from Lecco has just phoned her and told her that 'his office' (not 'him' mind you) had not noticed that they had already accepted my request. He added that she was likely to have a very angry Englishwoman arriving before too long! She also told me what she called him, but I don't know how to write the 'dialect' for what she said!!!!!

So after just 10 more minutes and I have all my documents in order and I'm back on the Dottoressa's list.
Phew!
So perhaps [COLOR="Red"][B]They're NOT Coming to Take Me Away [I]after all[/I] - Ha-Haaa! [/B]
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Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 04:49

Your Codice Fiscale is the key to life here, even more so than residency, really. You need to give the number when buying most larger items - cars are a specific case in point, where you can't get one at all without a number.

I have to admit that I haven't really had too many problems since I arrived here, full-time, back in 2000. My "rite of passage" through all the hoops to get my Codice Fiscale, my original PdS, Health card, Identity Card, driving license and my P.IVA was almost unbelievably easy. The key, in my opinion, to a relatively easy life is to forget the angry, Anglo-Saxon approach to life and relax a bit. Getting cross with public servants is ALWAYS a mistake - but getting cross with a policeman in the UK wouldn't get you very far either, would it!

Remember, you are in Italy and you are here because YOU want to be here. No one else cares particularly either way, so it is YOU that must make the effort - which will be rewarded many times over if you put a little effort in and SMILE.

At the end of the day, if you love living here, you will not find it difficult to "fit in" - if you don't love it - or just look on living here as a money-making investment opportunity, you won't "fit in" and may as well go home sooner than later, without giving yourself a heart attack by getting angry about Italian life and ways.

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 05:14

I think attitude has a lot to do with whether you make a success of living in Italy or not.

I have known people who tell me that they have confronted Italian officials and told them how inefficient and bureaucratic the rules are here, argued with them and insisted that they have no right to insist on whatever they are insisting on. Most of the time the official in question digs their heels in and the situation only gets worse.

If on the other hand you are prepared to have a bit of a joke, say ‘this is a real pain; is there anyway we can sort it out?’ mostly they will bend over backwards to be helpful.

Obviously this does not always work but most of the time it does.

I think it pays to think about if the situation was reversed and an Italian started shouting the odds in broken English at a council official in England – how far do you think they would get?:laughs:

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 07:29

If all else fails and you are female...no matter what your age is ...cry...real tears...never fails to get the help and understanding that you need!

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 12:03

And if the tears dont work - just drop on the floor and pretend you've fainted! Tried, tested and guaranteed! :bigergrin:

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Tue, 10/21/2008 - 13:27

Being female, crying and fainting certainly works, on occasions I've exploited all three, but generally speaking appealing to whoever you're dealing with's better nature invariably achieves the impossible. I agree, generally speaking, Italy does work. As Italians continually tell me, "there is a solution to everything except death". And when there is glitch along the way, surely we just shrug like good Italians and write it off with an, "e normale"?