10754 Living expenses in Abruzzo

Perhaps you could say more like the number of people, size of property, it's location (L'Aquila is the coldest place in Abruzzo in the winter), plan to grow your own fruit and vegetables and so on. Then maybe and I stress maybe someone here may be able to give you an answer.

this is hard to answer I have a hoilday home I use all year - well its the heating in the winter that is expensive - food if you buy the local stuff is cheap - but base your budget same as the Uk then add on extra for fuel in the winter - depending on the type of house - you should save on council tax but then you may get loads of visitors - they are expensive.

[quote=Anth08;100254]....... Be gentle, my future may hinge on your calculations.[/quote]

It would be best to be brutally frank, as your future is important.

.

It matters less where you live in Italy and more on how you live your life.
We live a very frugal life…We eat out rarely, we do not have a flashy car, we do not buy new clothes each season, we do not jet off here and there at a drop of a hat, we grow & EAT all our own food bottling & pickling & freezing any gluts, we eat very little of the expensive things i.e. fish & meats, we do favours for neighbours & friends and get paid in favours back in return, we only drink vino sfuso costing only a little over E1 a litre, direct from the cantina’s, don’t smoke, trips to the beach are arranged around the “big shop” & visiting friends, we text instead of phone when ever possible, we try & light the stove only in the evenings and wear woollies or fleeces to keep warm through the day, if we don’t need it we don’t buy it, we cruise past wheelie bins with an open eye, we have a make do and mend attitude, We do not always buy the cheapest, we did do our homework before we came and knew this is how we would have to live… What we didn’t know was IF we could till we tried.
We ran two wood burning stoves last year and the cost was E500/600 (for the year). A recent electric bill we received, and, consider our most expensive, E105 for 2 months (which was probably due to having visitors) and the use of the electric water heater being used twice a day, everyday while they were with us). For us vehicle fuel and mobile phone costs are a very large part of our monthly spend , but we do live in the country where a vehicle is essential for everything & we do not yet have a land line so have to put up with the expense of a mobile phone. Earlier this year we saved every receipt, every last Euro spent for 4 moths and calculated that our average monthly spend was less that E800 per month, this included heat & light ( averaged across the year) vehicle expenses, phone, internet access, odd meals out, hardware etc for garden & home etc…it couldn‘t include replacements of broken cookers, computers etc.
We have a very happy and fulfilled life, we love it here at the moment, we have an open attitude to life, we love each other ( this helps a lot). We live in Abruzzo where it is very hilly, steep and twisting and the roads are not always in top condition and reckon that if vehicle use is unrestrained our mileage would be double that that it had been in rural Yorkshire plus we have worn out a pair of tyres in 1 year!
Sprat

Good to know that life is still good for you Pilch. Is the tower finished yet?
Lorraine

I recollect Nielo, who lives in Abruzzo, posting similar details. He indicated that his house was small. I wonder what size is your house Pilchard? And what height is it please. This does make a difference to the cost of utilities no matter how careful you are.

Hello my friend Lizzy so here you are ! I wondered where you'd been..I was a member of this forum long before the 'other' one ! Looking forward to seeing you both soon...( Nov )
Jan

It's an impossible question to answer really. How long is a piece of string?

Pilchard has given some good pointers. But are you renting/buying, single/couple, in town/country, flat/house?? So although not in Abruzzo I rent a flat and have block expenses but no separate central heating/water costs, pay around €35 every three months for my gas bottle for cooking, around 20/25 a month for electricity; being single spend far too much on aperitivi occasionally, but generally cook from scratch at home. I run a car but can justify that as it gets me to various teaching jobs and off skiing in the winter.

So if you really do want help you'll need to give us a little more detail so we can tailor the advice.

Like the others have said it really depends on how you live. We are a family of four and we use the heat, electricity, car, phone etc when we need it. We are not cheap but we also do not waste. We live in Tuscany and not Abruzzo and we spend well over 800 euros a month... I have listed in my blog how much we spend for utility, food,etc. Check it out and let me know if you have specific questions. Lucia [url=http://www.living-italy.blogspot.com]Living Italy[/url]

I think what might be the real question is ‘How cheaply can you live in Abruzzo?’

And the answer is much more cheaply than in the UK.

If you have a bit of land it is possible to grow a lot of your food and if you are lucky enough to have neighbours like ours, you will also be given loads of home produce.

If you are resident there is no ‘council tax’ to pay. Insurances can be more expensive and heating in the winter – but with the huge price hikes in the UK it may not be that different now, and you have a lot of options to choose from, gas, wood, sansa etc.

You don’t need carpets and therefore don’t need a hoover – mop and bucket will do.

You won’t need a tumble dryer, nor the expense of running one as most days washing dries quickly. In winter you can dry it in front of the fire or over a radiator.

Depending where you live, you could do without a car altogether as the public transport system is good and much cheaper than in the UK.

I manage most of the year with either flip flops or wellies so shoes are not a great cost either.

Clothes are more expensive – no George at Asda here – but in my opinion are better quality so last longer if you shop carefully.

Medicines, common over the counter medicines, are more expensive but we pay only a dispensing fee of around a Euro for prescriptions.

If you use either Teleconomy Internationale or an Edi card your phone calls back to the Uk will not break the bank.

Eating out is far less expensive than I remember in the UK.

I certainly know that we could not live on our income in the UK but we are doing nicely here in Abruzzo.:bigergrin:

[quote=Nielo;101016]
Clothes are more expensive – no George at Asda here – but in my opinion are better quality so last longer if you shop carefully.:[/quote]

Setting aside Sunday's splurge in Florence on new pair of boots and an irresistible handbag from Furla (combined cost equivalent or more than many people's annual utility bills), I've been shopping more frugally for clothes of late and you can find some gems. Am currently wearing: very dapper tartan mule slippers (Euros 6, market); brown cords (Euros 8, market); thick polo neck jumper from Ovesse (spelling?), which set me back Euros 20 but is just as nice as similar ones in a fancy store in Siena selling for 5 times that; padded puffa waistcoat (Euros 10, market). Bought a Euros 12 polo neck jumper dress in market couple of weeks back that so many friends liked, they all rushed out to buy same. I don't know George at Asda prices but I don't think the above are bad for Tuscany. V
ps: you'll note sitting in house wearing quite a lot of clothes. It's chilly and damp today and I'd rather spend money on a jumper than put the heating on!

I see temperatures around Pescara currently around 22 and sunny - Bo Hoo. (Here in London it's around 9 which is below what is expected normally for this time of the year) So whereas of course it gets cold in Abruzzo, the winter season is relatively short and therefore fuel bills perhaps not as bad as further north.

However having said that you aclimatise to the weather by living there. 22 is not that warm and you add a jacket or turn the heating on!!!

The most expensive costs of living here are car insurance and heating bills. We have 2 cars, both insured through Italsure, just had the renewal for one @ approx E669, but that is for fully comprehensive. Fuel bills, electricity averages over the year at about E200 per month, peak winter E1200 for the 4 months, but for 24 hr heating and hot water. LPG circa E150 per year as only used on the gas hob. Wood cost, not enough to consider including.
Food & Wine: probably E80 per week as we cook a lot of oriental food. We do buy the 5ltr bottles from the local butcher, as he sells a very good 14% red and a good white for E6.50 each.
Vehicle servicing: much less than the UK.
Council Tax: nil, as no swimming pool or luxury villa.
We do not go out to eat so often due to having the dog.
Medicines: quite expensive as has been said before.
Yes, we do run a tumble dryer in the winter, 2x fridge freezers, microwave, dishwasher and 3Kw oven.
So, without any unforseen expense, we would consider around E800 -1000 per month to be about right.

Here in Abruzzo your heating costs will definitely be affected by how high up you are. Winter in Pescara is completely different to winter in L'Aquila, which is known as the coldest place in Italy!

As far as clothes are concerned, when I was in the UK I had an account at Oxfam and have been known to go to work in clothes where my underwear cost more than all the rest put together!:laughs:

[quote=Sally Donaldson;101021]22 is not that warm and you add a jacket or turn the heating on!!![/quote]

Apologies for momentarily hijacking thread but you're right, Sally, it really does depend upon what you're used to. Coming from London, my recent visitors found the weather (low 20s) just right but that's chilly for me and although I think it's 18 here today, it's been drizzly on and off so accordingly quite damp.

It's getting colder - hurrah - snow down to 1000/1200 metres later this week.:-)
Sorry.... I'm a skier....

Inside I've been in just a short sleeve top all day. Only now is it getting colder.

Oh yes - just been given a big bag of apples. He would have bought along more to the bar but he didn't realise I'd be in the car after work as I normally walk. Even in small cities it's surprising what you can end up with for free.

just to offer a wider version of how things seem to me at least....

growing stuff ... well food.. bottling and conserving... having land to do it on and to look after ... offers a lot of satisfaction and disappointment but has virtually no significant effect on cost of living here...

in another sense also its not like the UK in that you can go to local markets and buy the food at less than the cost to grow it and it is tasty and generally free of chemical input...

if indeed you take the supermarket route ... for say bottled tomato sauce for your pasta ... you will find that it costs sometimes even less than the empty bottle you buy from the shops in order to preserve your own produce....

i find estimates regarding the monthly spend here on the low side so far...although the posting by Luciam gets closer to the mark in our case even though she does not live in Abruzzo...

agree with geo about car insurance and heating costs... am not sure about the eating out costs... yes its a lot cheaper for the quality... but we find we spend more time doing it...as we have got to know people here get invited to weddings /christenings birthdays and such... you end up returning favors... am not complaining... i enjoy it all... and i love eating out... its not something that we feel we have to do... but we have not much else to offer for being included in the local life...

yes of course you end up helping with harvests... or building work... but its good also to give something tangible in return... so for us those costs add up... although cannot say have ever stopped to calculate it on a monthly basis....

teeth and dentists... huge amount of money for dental work... thats for children as well... spectacles...expensive... however pedicures and that sort of treatment very reasonable as are hairdressers.... pediatricians... astronomical....

having land and buying machinery ...OK a capital investment... but its expensive...maintaining land costs a lot...

living in the country has a premium cost ... much as when we lived in the UK in Devon all price rises affected country living more than people in cities and towns... a car is essential... there are maintenance costs and annual certificates to be obtained for gas boilers cars and rubbish tax...even if no council tax...

spend more on bars here as well... if you meet someone in the street here its pretty normal depending on the time of day to either be offered or offer a drink...from the quick coffee to an aperitif....

schools, school books, school outings and school parties all cost... holidays..
...dressing well here when invited out is also pretty well required... as foreigners we might not me the pressure so much... but it counts...

am not complaining... i enjoy life here and enjoy even more the lifestyle... i know i couldn't cope with some of the life choices people make when they do come here... but that's lucky as the world needs different approaches...

oh yes ... sports and sports clubs here cost less... annual palestra membership just under 400 euro which i bet beats most UK gyms... we have plenty here in Teramo and they are all well attended... most have pools and all the usual machines... so that's another cost...

and finally but not least dogs... if you come to live here and have half a heart you will end up with at the very least one... or a cat.. we now have four and have annual vet vaccination bills to pay for them... occasional visits as they do themselves some sort of damage.... and food costs.. again no complaints,... our vet from Montorio is outstanding and to my mind exceedingly cheap and generous in his treatments... apart from now being a good friend as well...

oh yes Christmas time here its usual to give some decent wine or such to whoever has helped you in a business/professional sense and treated you beyond what you would have considered to be a normal business/professional service ... not again because you have to... but it just seems to be the way... be at or close to a notary office around that time of year and they almost need a lorry to cart all the stuff away....

so no real figures... but there are lots of things that add up.... to what seems to me to be basic quotes...a bit like buying a car here... even the steering wheel if you go to a fiat garage comes as an extra cost... so if you feel you cannot restrain yourself from being warm at home...or do not have an inclination to become a food producer ...or even the capability and or garden... like eating out more than you should... then it can be hard here to stay within too strict a budget.....

"moved to italiauncovered.co.uk"

I think John is probably right, it is lovely to grow and preserve our own produce but in real terms probably does not save money, and Torch is to an extent right about the cold season being much shorter, but liquid gas is frighteningly expense for us not on town gas, but with fuel prices rising in the UK not sure how this would compare, but for alot of us here its put on another jumper not the central heating.
Car insurance high but repairs (at least from our mechanic) madly cheap.
Clothes, around here good cheap factory outlet selling wool and cashmere at very low prices,
Health care, very good but you do pay the ticket prices, drugs for me free due to medical conditions.
Leaving the dentist to the end! as I was private in the UK and am here, and have been away for 3 years hard to compare, but friends in UK say I would have paid more...still very expensive.
I think it is possibly to live simply , but not perhaps in a self sustaining way, living in the country is not cheap, and people planning to live here need to possibly be prepared to make sacrifices to their life style, living on a limited budget for many is an art form and worth it to be able to be here, but its a different way of living which may be hard for some to adjust too...unless you have loads of dosh that is!
A

Enjoyed reading and almost agree with Adriactica's post ...Quote ....teeth and dentists... huge amount of money for dental work... thats for children as well... spectacles...expensive...
We find the dentist (English) is less expensive and certainly Prescription glasses are MUCH cheaper. This week we both went to the Optomatrist for check ups...ww were in there over an hour as I have an eye problem. Cost 110 euros total for 2. Then off to the Opticians where there was a vast choice of frames and I chose lightweight titanium ones. My lense prescription is a bit complicated....ready in 3 working days total cost 150 euros for a pair. I would recommend anyone coming to Italy to bring their up to date prescription and have glasses made up here.

"moved to italiauncovered.co.uk"

[quote=Torchiarolan;101414]And we have a friend living in Italy, who now for first time has a tinted prescription lens in a decent looking sunglasses frame, - instead of a tinted prescription lens in a naff reading glasses type frame,... which she says she was never able to get whilst living in the UK before.[/quote]

That'll be me then, she says swanning around in the hot sunshine on 1st November no less, in her prescription designer sunglasses. And they cost me a lot less than my prescription glasses with dark (but not dark enough) lens bought in the UK

It may be just Puglia, and it may be helped that we no longer work - so no executive suits, commuting costs, working lunches etc, but we definitely manage very nicely on a lot less than we used to in UK. Switching to wood burning termo-camino central heating and solar power for hot water has made a huge difference to us this year. Certainly helped by the extremely sunny October ...... and continuing, with 26 degrees and sunshine all the way forecast for tomorrow.

I know people are busy and have problems with accessing the internet but I do think it a shame when an OP asks questions, gets useful answers and then never comes back to acknowledge or clarify.

Come on Sue - it's only just over a week, not everyone lives online - and it's never stopped us before from answering regardless if the OP returns or not. Look on it as an investment in the future. :smile:

Only a week? It seems longer:-) Ah, that's broadband for you, and having little breaks from lesson planning to look at the latest news. On a practical note though, it would help if we were to know more about the OP. I agree that that has never stopped us chiacheroni [?]...

[quote=sueflauto;101444]I know people are busy and have problems with accessing the internet but I do think it a shame when an OP asks questions, gets useful answers and then never comes back to acknowledge or clarify.[/quote]

chiacheroni??? Come si dice in inglese???

[quote=Sally Donaldson;101471]chiacheroni??? Come si dice in inglese???[/quote]

Si dice:
[B]chiacchieroni[/B] = gossips!

chiacchierare = to gossip, to chatter

[quote=Sally Donaldson;101471]chiacheroni??? Come si dice in inglese???[/quote]

Perbacco!! Tutto il mio mondo sembra capovolto. Brava Sally. :yes:

[quote=sueflauto;101469]Only a week? It seems longer:-) Ah, that's broadband for you, and having little breaks from lesson planning to look at the latest news. On a practical note though, it would help if we were to know more about the OP. I agree that that has never stopped us chiacheroni [?]...[/quote]

Thank you to all those who have posted so many useful pieces of information regarding my initial post. My excuse for not replying is that I have been moving house (in the u.k). Our situation would be two people, small old house in town in the province of L'Aquila, two mopeds, small garden, central heating I believe. Beyond that at this stage I can't say much more but am grateful to all of you for putting meat on the bones.

[quote=Noble;101410]Enjoyed reading and almost agree with Adriactica's post ...Quote ....teeth and dentists... huge amount of money for dental work... thats for children as well... spectacles...expensive...
We find the dentist (English) is less expensive and certainly Prescription glasses are MUCH cheaper. This week we both went to the Optomatrist for check ups...ww were in there over an hour as I have an eye problem. Cost 110 euros total for 2. Then off to the Opticians where there was a vast choice of frames and I chose lightweight titanium ones. My lense prescription is a bit complicated....ready in 3 working days total cost 150 euros for a pair. I would recommend anyone coming to Italy to bring their up to date prescription and have glasses made up here.[/quote]

These people are very good.

[url=http://www.specsonthenet.com/reglaze.jsp]SpecsOnTheNet - Reglazing Service[/url]

We have had several frames fitted with new prescriptions by them. Their new specs are good too. Just send them your eye-tests results and away you go.

Another tip, if you have a relatively simple prescription, is to buy cheap (Chinese) reading glasses on the net & if you have different L&R requirements buy one of each strength and make your own custom specs. If the lenses are symetrical you can actually make two pairs! I leave pairs all over the house, in the car etc. That way I can always grab a pair when needed.

Pip pip

I live about 30 km to the east of L'Aquila on the other side of the Gran Sasso and I've not seen anything in the comments here that I'd disagree with.

However, you asked only about expenses. The other side of the equation – income – is just as crucial and one that some Brits who are considering moving to Italy assume will be easy to sort out once they're here.

Perhaps you already have a job lined up in L'Aquila or you'll have a pension or other certain income and so it won't be an issue for you (unless the Pound continues its slide against the Euro). However, if you're hoping to make a living in Italy teaching English, running a B&B or doing the work you did in the UK, then please think very carefully about this and read the many threads here on just how very challenging that can be.

Please don't take this as patronising. Sadly, we've seen quite a few people on this forum over the years who have had glowing dreams of life in Italy, but only enough in the bank to live on for a few months and nothing more substantial than the hope that making a living will somehow sort itself out.

Al

[quote]By Allan: ".....Sadly, we've seen quite a few people on this forum over the years who have had glowing dreams of life in Italy, but only enough in the bank to live on for a few months and nothing more substantial than the hope that making a living will somehow sort itself out."
[/quote]

Allan is so right here... Unfortunately our general British trait of being happy to work our socks off if needed, and to hold down (often) several small jobs alongside our regular one, is just NOT an option in Italy. Here you are lucky to have even one job. Luckier if it's a fixed contract, and even luckier still if it pays anything near a 'living wage'.

It is pretty clear (well so it seems to me), that those who have the courage to sell up and leave all they 'know' in search of a happier life (with a bit of adventure thrown in for good measure), are going to be those that will [I]never[/I] hesitate to roll up their sleeves and work bl*ody hard and do [I]anything[/I] to attain their dreams.

But there is the 'rub' - [I][U]in Italy you can't do that![/U][/I] All you can do is ensure that you've done your research, and that you have MORE than sufficient funds to last you and support your lifestyle in case you [B]don't[/B] find a job!

If you haven't already bought your house I'd advise a careful rethink as Aquila is very cold.we are about 30 mins from Pescara where it can get chilly but even in Jan you can have days of 18 degs.

Although it may seem a lot to pay upfront if you can consider a solar hot water system.If you intend using your house most of the year you'll easily make back the outaly in a few years.

Consider also a house within walking distance from a bus route as that saves pennies.

If you are on a tight budget it may be best not to opt for buying lots of land as the costs for maintance may outweigh the benifits and we've experienced problems with flytipping.

[QUOTE=chrisnotton;101496]These people are very good.

[url=http://www.specsonthenet.com/reglaze.jsp]SpecsOnTheNet - Reglazing Service[/url]

We have had several frames fitted with new prescriptions by them. Their new specs are good too. Just send them your eye-tests results and away you go.
...............................................................................................................................
Yes thanks for that but you see I have Keratoconus and no online firm will make up glasses for me unfortunately. Here in Italy at reasonable cost. I can have a fabulous frame, even designer logo should I want such a thing....the glasses will also be well fitted to my nose so comfy to wear....

[QUOTE=myabruzzohome;101519]If you haven't already bought your house I'd advise a careful rethink as Aquila is very cold.we are about 30 mins from Pescara where it can get chilly but even in Jan you can have days of 18 degs.
............................................
I wonder has Anth08 read, On the Spine of Italy by Harry Clifton? An impoverished young couples stay in the Abruzzo in winter.

[quote=Anth08;101487]Thank you to all those who have posted so many useful pieces of information regarding my initial post. My excuse for not replying is that I have been moving house (in the u.k). [/quote]

Aargh! In that case my sympathies.:-)

[quote=Carole B;101473]Si dice:
[B]chiacchieroni[/B] = gossips!

chiacchierare = to gossip, to chatter[/quote]

Aia, le dopie, le dopie..... (only joking Carole...:bigergrin: )

[quote=sueflauto;101557]Aia, le dopie, le dopie..... (only joking Carole...:bigergrin: )[/quote]

Hey Sue,
Ma il '[B]p[/B]' singolo nel 'do[B]p[/B]io' va raddo[B]pp[/B]iato - facendo 'do[B]pp[/B]io'!
Sorry [IMG]http://209.85.12.234/7234/185/emo/hiding.gif[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.ggaonline.org/graemlins/rotfl1.gif[/IMG]

Richard
All the very best with your move. Very envious! Can't wait for us to do the same. :smile:

"moved to italiauncovered.co.uk"

[quote=Carole B;101558]Hey Sue,
Ma il '[B]p[/B]' singolo nel 'do[B]p[/B]io' va raddo[B]pp[/B]iato - facendo 'do[B]pp[/B]io'!
Sorry [IMG]http://209.85.12.234/7234/185/emo/hiding.gif[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.ggaonline.org/graemlins/rotfl1.gif[/IMG][/quote]

That's why I said 'only joking'.:-) That one I knew. Often I tend to be a bit random, I know.

[quote=Noble;101521][QUOTE=myabruzzohome;101519]If you haven't already bought your house I'd advise a careful rethink as Aquila is very cold.we are about 30 mins from Pescara where it can get chilly but even in Jan you can have days of 18 degs.
............................................
I wonder has Anth08 read, On the Spine of Italy by Harry Clifton? An impoverished young couples stay in the Abruzzo in winter.[/quote]

Yes, I know the book and was suitably frightened by it! you're absolutely right; it must be a 'must read' for anyone considering a move to an Abruzzese rural location.

[quote=sueflauto;101622]That's why I said 'only joking'.:-) That one I knew. Often I tend to be a bit random, I know.[/quote]
I knew too.... :winki: