11027 Building Bridges

How about a strada party, invite all the neighbours to see the house etc, lay on a few beers and some english cooking, not to much english food though, and a couple of pasta dishes, plus games for the kids ..........

Thats sad, especially for a child that is lonely, and in a foreign country as well. But I think it would depend very much on what they have done to "upset" the neighbours, before a possible solution might be found.
A

As Angie says, it's a bit difficult to make any useful suggestions without knowing some of the history.

It is possible that the British family are lovely people who have unfortunately landed in the middle of a tiny village populated by several feuding factions which cherish slights done to each other decades ago. In that situation, it's all too easy for incomers to unwittingly violate taboos, trample across invisible boundaries and so cause great offence.

On the other hand, it's possible that the British family are a bunch of insensitive clots who are simply too ignorant to realise that they're not in Surrey anymore.

It seems to me that the options for finding a positive way forward would be quite different in those two situations.

Al

I agree that it is important to find out why the neighbours are upset and then talk to the British family and explain all this. It may be a problem of communication and not understanding each other's cultural differences. A mediator who can speak calmly to both parties and try to fix up things is absolutely necessary. Also, a talk to the school authorities may be needed to help the child to integrate and make friends. Pehaps to organise a party as suggested will be excellent, but once everything has been clarified and there is not a chance of the problem starting all over again. Also, the attitude (or better, the change of attitude) of the British couple is most important. If they have infuriated several people, they need to patch up things with them.

Good suggestions but I think the time for a party is passed - from what I hear no one would go!

The British family set up a business – all legit as far as I know – which is in direct competition to local Italians. I think this has caused a certain amount of rancour and their little girl does not attend the local school so does not mix with local children.

I would love to be able to help but they are not in my area. I have suggested that perhaps they could fund some sports equipment for the football team or offer to help with their local Festa, but things are a bit chilly and they are actually thinking of moving.

They seem perfectly nice to me and really wanted to throw themselves into life in Italy but they are in a small place where if you upset one you upset all.

It is strange really because I know of another similar family who are getting on really well. Maybe it is not them but where they are.

Chilly, I expect it is freezing!, and can understand why local Italians are unhappy, its easy for me to say a misguided move on the part of the English people, and an expensive one if they are to leave, but surely they had considered the impact this would have on the community? especially if it is a small tight knit one.
I would doubt that anything could be done to resolve it now, and as was said a street party would be ill attended.
There is often talk of research on this forum and sadly it would appear that this was not thought through.
A

Perhaps some might think it a silly question, but why do they need to get along with their neighbours?

As long as things have not descended to the point of open conflict with damage to people, pets or property, why can't they just accept the situation and live with the fact that their circle of friends will not include anyone living a few doors away? Perhaps a major problem is that this is not how they visualised their life in Italy? Maybe they had some idea of slotting effortlessly into a close-knit community and being welcomed for both their entrepreneurial spirit and their experience of the wider world?

However, I am curious why, if the Brits did have this golden dream of becoming an integral part of village life, their daughter is not attending the same school as the other local kids?

Perhaps if the family are always studiously polite to the locals, do what they can to avoid irritating them and behave honourably and honestly in their business affairs, the frost might – in a decade or so – thaw a little.

It seems to me, at best, pointless and, at worst, counter-productive for the British family to try to do a sales job on the locals, so I think Gala is right (although maybe not in the way she meant) about the Brits possibly needing to change their attitude. I'd suggest that they accept that they have a choice of either living with the situation they find themselves in and being very patient with their neighbours or moving house.

Al

Perhaps, if they can start employing locals they will not be regarded as competitors. I don't know if it is possible, but I would say that it would be less expensive than having to sell everything and start all over again....
Also, if they have upset so many people, I do not thing they will have too many customers for their business...

All very true,

The business does not have local customers but I think the suggestion of employing a local is a good idea and I’ll pass on the suggestion.

I think they are just very disappointed not to have been welcomed and now they feel a bit isolated. It can’t be pleasant to be shunned anywhere and least of all when you have made a drastic move far from family and friends.

It is a real shame for them. Who knows where the cause came from.

When we started Sibillini Cycling, we had plenty of people say to us "what do you want to do that for? XXX rents bikes down the road" or "all the agriturismos already have bikes" etc. etc. but when we dug a little deeper, the agriturismos have some tired old MTB's that no-one maintains and XXX will charge you the whole amount for a bike on your credit card (effectively selling you the thing) and then credit you back the difference when you return it to get round having to have a licence. So we weren't actually competing with anyone.

There can also be local resentment from parents saying to themselves "my Mario/Maria should be doing that. They're taking his/her job" when in fact Mario/Maria has no interest is doing any such thing at all. It can be easy to cause resentment without intending to.

Maybe for this family it is a perception thing and they are not stealing the bread out of locals mouths in the way that people think. Mind you, how you resolve it is another thing.......

I'm with Penny on this one - a perception thing and they are not stealing the bread out of locals mouths. It's all too easy to feel outcast by a sour faced neighbour that has gotten out of bed the wrong side and is grimacing about his or her own problems, but the incomers think the sour face is aimed towards them.

Sorting it out is easy - tell the incomers to create some mystery and gossip - a scandal - the more twisted and unbelieveable the better - perhaps they have been exiled to Italy because the husband had an affair with the wife of - (insert well known name) - back in the UK, or he is on the run from the Inland Revenue/East End gangsters (that always goes down very well in a small Italian village).

Then, they really must spread outrageous rumours about how the wife actually is the daughter of the very famous and extremely rich ruler of some obscure country. The neighbours will all pretend to know who this ruler is and will nod in agreement when you tell them the country is called Ogbogoogoo - just off the B415 near Hartlepool.

Here's the clincher - make them promise that they will never tell another living soul about the dark shameful family secrets- especially the other neighbours. The news will spread like wildfire and the whole village will be knocking on the door within hours with invitations and baskets of goodies so they can see what further scandalous juicy gossip they can glean.

Sorted! :bigergrin:

Thank you Julian, very amusing and actually it probably would work. Somehow I don't think the family in question could carry it off, I don't think they have the imagination. Possibly part of their problem.

Then you must do it for them - probably best if someone else rather than the incomers start the rumours anyway - get inventive! :wideeyed:

[SIZE=2]We live in a very rural part of Italy and we certainly noticed a fantastic change of attitude to us when we started digging our terraces, planting olive trees and hunting for mushrooms. Our villagers were very keen to tell us how we should be doing things (you can imagine the mess we were making!!!) and we made a lot of friends.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]We read many books (on Italy) before we came here and some advice has always stuck in my mind:[/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]In esscence, love all (good) things Italian[/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]Appreicate your surroundings.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Grow your own vegetables.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Work on your own land.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Oh, and enjoy Italian food.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]Not too difficult![/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]I think what I am trying to say, is ditch the ‘English’ and go native! [/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]Hopefully not too late for them.[/SIZE]

[quote=Nielo;104017]Thank you Julian, very amusing and actually it probably would work. Somehow I don't think the family in question could carry it off, I don't think they have the imagination. Possibly part of their problem.[/quote]

you never actually said what business activity these people run to have generated such ostracism on the part of local people...i can't imagine what it can be
it may be that what they do has nothing to do with the whole thing but rather its themselves.

Perhaps they've started up a lap-dancing club!

Seriously though, Persephone's approach is very valid: pick the 'wrong' roadside weeds for your salad and all the passing cars will stop and tell you what you are doing wrong, implore you to follow them to a much better selection of roadside weeds, invite you back to their home to sample the weeds with their own olive oil - and you have obtained that most important rural relationship in Italy - you have found your 'contadino di fiducia'!

Charles, you have brought my point to life!! Thank you.

[quote=Charles Phillips;104126]

Persephone's approach is very valid: pick the 'wrong' roadside weeds for your salad and all the passing cars will stop and tell you what you are doing wrong, implore you to follow them to a much better selection of roadside weeds, invite you back to their home to sample the weeds with their own olive oil - and you have obtained that most important rural relationship in Italy - you have found your 'contadino di fiducia'![/quote]

And the best thing is you won't have to try to pick the "wrong" thing! One of the most consistent things we and other Brits have found is that no matter what you do or how you do it there is always someone who will tell you "you don't want to do it like that". I have found it to be incredibly liberating- gone is the stress of "will I do it wrong" cos I know I will, and as Charles says you will usually end up at somone's house or having a neighbour come with you to market (to check you don't mess up the next thing you do) or you will pop in to say hello & end up with eggs, potatoes, pecorino cheese, cabbage or a rabbit (dead, skinned & without it's head!). The only problem is it's very difficult to reciprocate as if you take anything to them (which we try to do frequently as we would be lost without our neighbours, or at least still trying to get the car out of the field I crashed it into) firstly you get told off & then they disappear & come back with eggs, potatoes, pecorino cheeses or a rabbit & it starts all over again!!!

[quote=HelenMW;104173]The only problem is it's very difficult to reciprocate[/quote]

So true. When we offer drinks (in the bar or at home) and get the 'no, no'no', it took us a long time to work out that it can actually mean, 'yes, okay then'.

However, with other items, we have not been so lucky (sorry Nielo I am off on a bit of a wander on your thread, but it might still help):

[LIST]
[*]Home-made sharon fruit chutney - nil points
[*]Pork pie - mixed reaction
[*]Bottle of Bombardier beer - 8 points
[*]Parsnip chips (from home grown parsnips) - 10 points (although our neigbours were so impressed with the parsnips that they grew there own and ate the leaves!)
[/LIST]

I love your description of 'roadside weeds', which is, I suppose exactly what they are... but in fairness the main ones (in Lombardia at least) are known as "insalata matta" (mad salad) or 'dente di leone' (lion's tooth).
[IMG]http://www.lacucinaitaliana.it/img_repository/img_glossario/tarassaco.gif[/IMG]

They are best picked around Easter when the first growth of the year begins to show, so you get the young, tender leaves. But these are just [I]ordinary[/I] DANDELION LEAVES! They are eaten traditionally as a salad with hard boiled eggs and maybe a sprinkling of cold crispy fried pancetta. [IMG]http://static.flickr.com/116/284240599_fcd19e5bf5_m.jpg[/IMG]
They are supposed to be good for the skin and for digestion.

Yes you can collect the older leaves (when flowering is finished), but they are of course far less tender or appetising, and can be used as a salad with almost any food...