12460 Blindfold your guests? News II

Hi Charles - eventually you will be able to sample the kind of discussions that are taking place. I am thinking in terms of screenshots, discussion extracts, etc. So you will get a taster - you will be able to have a clear idea of what happens in the community space (but not necessarily what happened today). Perhaps we even get a few members write up what they think of the community.

But in order to get the full experience you have to join - and even then you will need to show some activity before more doors open up.
We are willing to sacrifice page views in order to get more interaction. We are really not looking for another 7000 members - but maybe just 100 that post once a week and know each other and feel well with what is happening.

Good news is we already have more than 60 people signed up!

Thing is - you need to really want to sign up. This is not immediate gratification (goes against the flow a bit I realise that...).

[quote=Charles Phillips;121100]About this new community.

I appreciate that information about how it will function is a work in progress, and I'm not pressing for 'further details' anytime soon, but I (for one) won't even be considering signing up until I've seen a sample of what sort of 'community' it is that I'm signing up to. Even Facebook and Dateline allow me to do that....

This begs the question, will this preview of the community ever be available to me before I sign up? Would I get a chance to have a look at what is being discussed on as a guest? If not, this gross handicap would apply to anybody with an interest in Italy, or a question to ask, or information to give - so it isn't going to become a very big community.

The number of people hitting the site, thinking - ooh, I'm going to wait 24 hours before I can even read anything on this community part of the site, then I'll remember to come back.....well, counting on toes comes to mind.

I hope someone will assure me that guests will be able to read most of the stuff published by community members - or was Ronald serious when he said he'd be happy with twenty contributors?[/quote]

Charles.

Perhaps this might help, I have asked some very similar questions of the Admin here and they were kind enough to provide me with this prompt reply....

[I]Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneto15
Ronald two questions regarding the new site.

(Q1) Am I correct in understanding the one first has to register BEFORE I am able to see what information you/the site require me to complete and keep up to date in my profile?

[/I][B]Currently yes - but we will provide a better explanation of what is inside to new members when we fully launch.[/B]

[I]Quote:
Originally Posted by Oneto15
(Q2) Will non members ie 'Guests' be able to see all the information/posts in the new forum as they have been in the old? [/I]

[B]no - most information will be behind the curtains - as I said we will explain what you will be able to see/do once you join but you have to sign up for it.[/B]

ronald
[I]End Quote.[/I]

Regards Oneto15. :smile:

[B][I]EDIT: Ronald beat me to it.[/I][/B]

24 hours have now passed since i put my name down to sign up.............And i have had no reply!

Silly me!! I've been waiting in vain for a reply to one of my posts in another thread until I realised it had been locked - and so, noticing that this thread is the new improved mark II version, I'll post a slightly edited version here and wait for my reply as it seems this is the thread to be seen in.

Ron

[It's not that I don't trust you or your motives - I've always seen you as a decent bloke - even for all the arguments you and I have had in the past, but surely you are aware of what has happened here in the last week or so and will understand why so many (not just me this time) were "up in arms" about the subforum. If you knew you were doing this and "moving us to Venus" and that is the reason you didn't set a subforum up - then why not let us know and so much could have been avoided?

I'm not saying that this was the reason you didn't set up the subforum - but it would be good to hear it straight from you - one way or the other.]

Moving on - I've only had a quick look, but it seems a valid reason for wanting to join the new venture has to be given and then you and your team will decide if our (my) "applications" are acceptable - which seems fair enough if things are to be a clean slate.

Lets get to the point Ron, cus we both know where I'm heading - lets say for example members like me apply - will the applications be accepted by you and the rest of the team if this really is to be a "fresh start"?

Another question if I may - if you accept membership from people lets say, like me, then will the past really be left behind and will "people like me" be handled in exactly the same fair way as everyone else will be dealt with - without the past tainting views or influencing new judgements not only of you and your team, but also of every other member?

Will AbC be able to restrain themselves from calling JC an elephant so that I dont feel the need to call them a pig in return? I can do it - but only if others really can do it too. I can let the past fall away as if it never happened - but can everyone else and even if they can - will they?

So, lets say you accept membership from "someone like me" and lets say "someone like AbC" calls me an elephant in the new place and I lose my temper and call them a pig return - which one of us would get the ban?

If you take the problems that exist here with you to the new place - will you also take the same solutions? If you do - then nothing will change and if AbC calls me an elephant - then there is nothing more sure than eggs are eggs that I will call AbC a pig in return.

Your answer may be to say to "people like me" don't apply to join and my reply to you would be that you are biased and unfair not to accept my application while accepting the application of "people like AbC".

If you do reject JCs application over AbC's application then you and your team would be condoing the behaviour of AbC and showing that it is acceptable for them to call JC an elephant, but not acceptable for JC to call AbC a pig in return.

How do you propose to deal with problems such as this should they arise in the new Piazza?

Final questions from me - and you know why I am asking - because I am sure you have read the relevant threads in the Mods Corner.

Am I correct in assuming (from what I have read so far) that the provision of a PM box is not an automatic facility that anyone will have from the beginning and that the provision of such features will have to be " earnt" by some type of merit system?

What criteria needs to be met in order to be "rewarded" with the priviledge of a PM facility - will it be awarded for, lets say, the number of posts a member produces - or will it be awarded soley on the quality of the posts a member produces?
.
I hope to hear from you on all these points as I feel sure they are relevant to many "members like me" who will want to know exactly what they are signing up for before they finally decide to apply or not.

Thankyou for your clarification Ronald, it is as I feared!

"Good news is we already have more than 60 people signed up!"
Would I be incorrect if I assumed these people are exclusively established Italy Mag forum members? I really cannot see your model ever attracting anybody else. Isn't the idea of social networking that you meet NEW like-minded people, or are you reverting to the golf-club waiting list scenario?

"Thing is - you need to really want to sign up. This is not immediate gratification (goes against the flow a bit I realise that...)."
So, you are taking a quantum leap into Web4! I sincerely do not wish you anything other than success in this venture - but I simply do not see either what you are aiming for, nor how you hope to achieve it.
You only have to look at the majority of posts in the "Introduce yourself" subforum to appreciate that loads of members' first posts tell you that "I am so pleased to have found this forum", or that they have been lurking. Now that isn't going to happen if they can't even see what's on offer in this new 'community' theme. I understand that YOU want a nice quiet little bar - but I really don't think you are assisting "Lovers of Italy".
Is there a hidden agenda to which I have not twigged, or do you really have a brilliant idea? If the latter, then sell it harder.

let me try and explain again:

There *will* be an introduction to the community. There are *many* ways to explain what is going on "inside" and show parts of it to motivate people to join without actually exposing all the content. there are really thousands of ways to do that.

The current community front page would only really make sense to who was already on the forums and joined the discussions here. That will of course change to actually explain to people more about what the community is about.

Currently about 60 joined purely on the back of having followed discussions on these forums. The community is not promoted in any way in any other space on the website - there is not even an actual link to it from anywhere on the website! That for me is fantastic.

Have you ever noticed how the forums have never been promoted in any other part of the website. Most people that visit italymag.co.uk never realise that there are forums. And many more people visit the rest of the website when compared to how many visit the forums.

Have you ever seen a link on our front page saying "join our forums"? There was only ever a rather vague "Community" link on the menu bar.

So don't worry Charles - we can do a lot to attract a lot of people.

First, however, we need to have a space that we are happy with. That is what we are working towards

In any case many thanks for your concern about the success or not of the community. if you are ever curious about how things are developing just drop me an e-mail and I will be happy to update you.

JC - just so you know - "the elephant in the room" is an expression. It means something blindingly obvious which everyone avoids mentioning. Although I think you know that anyway but couldn't resist the opportunity for outrage.

Anne, honestly, do you think I don't know what "the elephant in the room" means? It's just corporate mindset twaddle for an obvious topic, which, as you say, everyone knows about, but wont discuss because it's considered uncomfortable or embarrassing.

It's a bit like when you twitch your net curtains - everyone knows you do it - but no one will ever tell you to your face that you're a sour faced gossipmonger who is intent on malevolently claiming to see something flagitious where no such thing exists.

So, with that in mind, can you please just go and look at the post again - and you will see I have not mentioned "[B]the elephant in the room[/B]" have I? :nah:

I only mentioned an elephant - not the room - which has a completely different significance.

I don't know, perhaps something is blinding you - but please try to be more attentive as the men in white coats may be just around the corner if you insist you can see things that aren't really there.

Sigh. I don't know! :no:

QED
Quod Erat Demostrandum

[quote=annec;121169]QED
Quod Erat Demostrandum[/quote]

Ditto! :bigergrin:

[quote=Charles Phillips;121100]About this new community.

I appreciate that information about how it will function is a work in progress, and I'm not pressing for 'further details' anytime soon, but I (for one) won't even be considering signing up until I've seen a sample of what sort of 'community' it is that I'm signing up to. Even Facebook and Dateline allow me to do that....
[/quote]

Personally, I am willing to take the leap and trust the creators of this site. After all, you don't pay anything and it is not a lifetime commitment (you could join, look at the forum and leave if it is not for you).

Perhaps the answer is to trust your instinct; if something is bothering you then don't sign up. Conversely if you like the idea, take the plunge.

Ronald,

what will happen to all the useful info contained on this existing forum? Will we still be able to search it? Will we still be able to read it? Will it be migrated in some way?

Interested parties could archive the forum to their hard drive using HTTrack (for windows). I've done this to a couple of sites which subsequently vanished. Easy and free.

[quote=Penny;121265]Ronald,

what will happen to all the useful info contained on this existing forum? Will we still be able to search it? Will we still be able to read it? Will it be migrated in some way?[/quote]
well (before live posting started in the new place, since when I've been denied access to the previously public "statement of purpose" links) I'm sure it contained a confirmation that the content from the"old" forum would be retained. it didn't say how but it will still be there - though possibly only for those who are members of the new place?.

Pigro it is my understanding that this forum will remain [B]as is [/B]for everybody to see :yes:

I believe that there are "bad arguments" occuring in the new place already and there's mention of the whole thing "imploding" ... (thats a nerd joke for the unregistered, so I'm probably playing to an audience of one here, no change there then ...)

[quote=pigro;121301]I believe that there are "bad arguments" occuring in the new place already and there's mention of the whole thing "imploding" ... (thats a nerd joke for the unregistered, so I'm probably playing to an audience of one here, no change there then ...)[/quote]

Very interesting commentary Pigro, :yes: and given that most, if not all of the [I]so characterised [/I] troublesome members of this forum are unlikely to be registering with the new community website, it seems even at this early stage all does not bode well in the piazza! :wideeyed:

sorry, I'd best nip this one in the bud before I infect the brave new world with the plague of rumour & misinformation that they're trying to outrun ...

[quote=pigro;121304]sorry, I'd best nip this one in the bud before I infect the brave new world with the plague of rumour & misinformation that they're trying to outrun ...[/quote]
Not trying to stir the pot were you Pigro? :laughs: ...... however, I take your point, but nerd jokes only work if you're in the club, the rest of us take what is written at face value..

[quote=Oneto15;121306]Not trying to stir the pot were you Pigro? :laughs: ...... .[/quote]
nah - gas just got disconnected, pot's contents are congealing & they've taken away the spoons anyway in case someone injures themselves/attacks another member. That leaves nothing substantial to consume here, but here's a spangle for auld lang syne:

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