2696 What Are Moderators?

Moderators are first and foremost people who have the best interests of the Forum as a whole at heart and who try to steer threads and postings in a positive direction as far as possible.

[QUOTE=Sano]Moderators are first and foremost people who have the best interests of the Forum as a whole at heart and who try to steer threads and postings in a positive direction as far as possible.[/QUOTE]

Hear Hear, very important people. Thanks to the moderators for all the work you do.

Sano,

I was unaware that there were any moderators when I first joined this forum because everything appeared moderate and that low-key thoughtful approach seemed to work very well. Now moderation seems everywhere -within the last couple of weeks a number of threads have been locked and others deleted. In all my time previous to this I only recall one other thread ever being closed. This seems to be since the introduction of new rules and moderators and has caused a good deal of confusion already. The new rules seem to offer the moderators a great deal of discretion over the sanctions they can apply. There is much mention of these powers but little concerning the rights of members and the protection of those rights. Nothing about redress in the event that members are unhappy with moderation. GeorgeS claims to have moderator's RIGHTS but a more democratic approach would be to consider moderator's powers as privilges granted by the other forum members.

[QUOTE=sdoj]Sano,

I was unaware that there were any moderators when I first joined this forum because everything appeared moderate and that low-key thoughtful approach seemed to work very well. Now moderation seems everywhere -within the last couple of weeks a number of threads have been locked and others deleted. In all my time previous to this I only recall one other thread ever being closed. This seems to be since the introduction of new rules and moderators and has caused a good deal of confusion already. The new rules seem to offer the moderators a great deal of discretion over the sanctions they can apply. There is much mention of these powers but little concerning the rights of members and the protection of those rights. Nothing about redress in the event that members are unhappy with moderation. GeorgeS claims to have moderator's RIGHTS but a more democratic approach would be to consider moderator's powers as privilges granted by the other forum members.[/QUOTE]

The big problem we have had over the past few months is that there has been an increase in aggressive and inflammatory posts on the forum. Even levity, if not managed, can spoil an otherwise good an informative website or derail an otherwise useful thread.

People have become upset, and either fallen silent or left the forum completely. I am all for the softly softly approach to moderation, but it only works if you have people playing along on the forum. At the moment this is not the case with everyone and some tough (and occcasionally hasty) decisions have resulted.

It would be nice if those who feel the need to snipe continually would get over themselves, and whatever it was that upset them initially, and move on - galling though that may seem to them. It is the only way forward - the alternative is an endless cycle of 'he said, no she said' that goes nowhere and creates a bad atmosphere on the website.

I would encourage those few people who seem to have an intense and irreconcilable dislike for each other to make use of the 'ignore' function under your User CP rather than continue to take swipes at one another.

..and it was v. funny ;)

[QUOTE=Sano]Moderators are first and foremost people who have the best interests of the Forum as a whole at heart and who try to steer threads and postings in a positive direction as far as possible.[/QUOTE]

In my original post at the top of the page I quoted the forum's FAQs where we are told that moderators would be selected for their specialist knowledge of certain subjects and implies that different moderators would be assigned to different areas of the forum but that dos not seem to what is happening here.
In the absence of full blown moderator elections I would like to request that the forum is divided into three sections plus CdC with two mods each assigned to the busiest two sections and one mod. to the least busy (with Ronald to cover during absences). CdC could be patrolled by all mods but on a rota basis.
The assignments and the rota could be posted for all to see and forum members would gravatate to where the moderating was to their gusto.
I hope you will give it a try.

Im I wrong in thinking that all Ronald has deleated are the threads that contained chit chat and no real info, no doubt someone will tell me to shut up in a mo, but what was the chat room created for....:rolleyes:

[QUOTE=sdoj]There is much mention of these powers but little concerning the rights of members and the protection of those rights.[/QUOTE]

The right to publish, straight from your computer keyboard live to the Forum is a fairly powerful thing in itself. Forum members enjoy the right to do this the moment they sign-up. Posts don't have to go through the moderation process before appearing (as they do, for example, with many newspaper web sites)

[QUOTE=sdoj]Nothing about redress in the event that members are unhappy with moderation.[/QUOTE]

There's nothing to prevent people from using the Forum to make a public complaint about a moderating decision that they disagree with. Better still, send a private message to the moderators in the first instance and state your case for the post to be reinstated.

[COLOR="Red"]The following post was originally posted in this thread but was moved overnight presumably because the moderator thought I had posted it in the wrong place but I hadn't!
This post concerns moderators powers and the sometimes arbritary way in which they are used and therefore it belongs here.
[/COLOR]

I deleted a post today immediately after I had written it because it was not funny and could have been interpreted as insulting to a certain group of society - although that was not it's intention.

Ronald later used that post to illustrate the non-temporal nature of many postings but surely since I self-censored there was no harm done and re-broadcasting it was against my express wishes and may create harm.

I have joined this forum last April, and posted about 150 times. In all my readings of many posts I cannot understand what the reason is for all this crying about nasty posts. I have yet to read one that is really offensive, or in real bad taste. Am I just reading the sedate posts by chance; I think not.

Also, there are times when the tit for tat goes on a little too long, there is nothing wrong when one decides to throw in the towel, so to speak. I recently did just that.;)

[quote=FrancisM]I have joined this forum last April, and posted about 150 times. In all my readings of many posts I cannot understand what the reason is for all this crying about nasty posts. I have yet to read one that is really offensive, or in real bad taste. Am I just reading the sedate posts by chance; I think not.

Also, there are times when the tit for tat goes on a little too long, there is nothing wrong when one decides to throw in the towel, so to speak. I recently did just that.;)[/quote]

Francis I quite agree with you and feel that this is getting very draconian

[QUOTE=FrancisM]I have joined this forum last April, and posted about 150 times. In all my readings of many posts I cannot understand what the reason is for all this crying about nasty posts. I have yet to read one that is really offensive, or in real bad taste. Am I just reading the sedate posts by chance; I think not....[/QUOTE]

Hello Francis,

Like you, I joined last spring, enjoying being part of this community, reading many posts - and gained lots of valuable information from them, even though we're nowhere near buying a property in Italy. However, I got quite upset about something that was said a few months ago, but the poster clarified his comments and that was the end of the matter for me. I'd learnt that some comments are not meant as they might seem and have learnt a valuable lesson. :)

People can easily get upset by something someone else says. As was mentioned many times before, it's tricky to interpret people's opinions, controversial or not, as we don't see the person saying them! Smilies can be used to make sure a comment doesn't come across as insulting but not everyone uses them.

After a week away in Rome, I was quite sad to come back today to the same old issues. Yes, I'm one of those seemingly unpopular moderators. But as I'm sure the other mods do, I read very carefully the various posts and hope to react accordingly where necessary. So far, I haven't deleted any posts (though tempted once or twice) but if I'll step on someone's toes in the future, it'll hopefully only be because that person had stepped onto someone else's! :)

The regs are not meant to be draconian but it protects some who do indeed get upset. Sadly, it happens quite regularly and we have PMs to prove it.

I'm all for a good, lively discussion with different opinions but we've got to keep personal attacks out of it. Unfortunately, that keeps happening. Loved many of those threads with their politically incorrect comments (much needed!) and I agree that the not-so-sweet & happy side of life in Italy has to be highlighted too, as some people might otherwise walk straight into a trap. We can make members aware of hiccups and problems in certain areas, but have to refrain from letting this turn into a mud fight...

Well, at least that's [B]my[/B] interpretation .... End of sermon! ;)

Cheers,
Stephanie

PS - By the way, the traffic in Rome..............;)

Iona..

I am POSITIVE that you are NOT "one of those seemingly unpopular moderators".. anything but in fact!

:) :)

Iona,

Glad to see you still have your head screwed on about all of this.
It would be interesting to know though, how many of the complaints you recieve are just misunderstandings, lack of humour or just like to winge. Not saying that none are not genuine but how much influence do these PM's give presidence over all other members who stand back and take it all in their stride as it should be.

Stephanie,

I am glad you had a good time in Rome - it must be a big job reading all these posts but you shouldn't feel sad. This is a debate about the future direction of this forum and I for one will follow and respect whatever consensus prevails at the end of the process. If no consensus is possible then I will leave the forum as Ronald has already suggested I might do.

When I saw your name as one of the new moderators I was very pleased as I have always respected your opinions and the way you present them without any obvious axe to grind. Your postings today bear out my judgement and I can see that you are an excellent moderator.

In the main the moderation is excellent here and it always has been. The team of moderators obviously had to be increased and a set of rules should serve us well. However, there was no consultation and what we are debating now is whether those rules are suitable for this forum or are too draconian. Had we had this debate beforehand, as we did with the chat-rrom for example, then there would not be this furore now.

There is another emerging debate about which posts should be deleted and whether any deleted posts should be re-broadcast wihout the poster's consent. On the first point, I acknowledge that there may be good practical reasons for a bit of spring-cleaning from time to time but again most forum members who care at all would like to be consulted about this. On the second point, I am quite sure that the majority of members would not like deleted posts re-broadcast without their consent - on the chatroom today one of our most esteemed Italian members was quite outspoken on the subject.

The question I suppose is: whether forum members are to be respected as stake-holders in this on-line community and consulted about changes or if they must learn to accept a like-it-or-lump-it "management" style.

ciao ciao

[LEFT]The House Rules are meant to define the direction of this forum.

Those coupled with the fact that this forum is about Italy and, as such, should remain as far as possible on this topic defines the direction of the forum.

I urge all of you to read the House Rules and I am happy to accept any suggestions on how they could be changed, etc.

sdoj - regarding the debate on deleted posts I think you are absolutely right. Deleted posts should remain deleted. Finally, regarding the ability of members to define the direction of the forum again you are right. And surely if you have a look at my past posts you will see that a large number of them is either asking about future steps (forum re-organisation for example) or responding to requests (chat room, circolo di conversazione, etc). We will always try to respond to any requests.

All the best,

Ronald[/LEFT]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Ronald, It would be nice for members to know what is going on if rules are implemented. That way everyone would know exactly the situation, moderators would be prepared for the barrage of PM’s and you would not have to ignore the thread I started of asking WHY because we would know in the first place![/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]So which was it: Hasty move, glitch or you know nothing?[/FONT][/COLOR]

[QUOTE=trullomartinafranca]Iona,

Glad to see you still have your head screwed on about all of this.
It would be interesting to know though, how many of the complaints you recieve are just misunderstandings, lack of humour or just like to winge. Not saying that none are not genuine but how much influence do these PM's give presidence over all other members who stand back and take it all in their stride as it should be.[/QUOTE]

Good point, trullo...

I guess it's probably a selection of all points you mentioned. That's what makes it so tricky, as you have to get both sides of the story. I wouldn't give precedence to members sending PMs over any others but rather try to find a compromise for all sides.... After all, when I was upset, I didn't send any PMs either so nobody really knew apart from my comments on those threads. I agree with you that we should all stand back and take things in their stride... but it's not always easily done.

As Ronald said, everyone can make suggestions towards the rules & I'm very happy to discuss any per pm... :)

Cheers!

BTW - Grazie mille, Aliena!! ;)

Ahh yes but Iona you have your head screwed on.

Will PM you when I have more time

Ciao

[QUOTE=ronald][B]which thread is that[/B]? Could you give me a link. Will be happy to read and respond.

Thanks.

Ronald[/QUOTE]
This is one of the big problems Ronny.. you are selective in what you choose to read or due to lack of time.. are unable to read everything.

Then you come sweeping along with a duster and polish the family silver with Brasso and that simply leaves everything rather dull!

There are specialist cleaning products available for family heirlooms.. I know of one that even blows bits of fluff away!

:) :)

Oooer Ronny..

I think we just had an earthquake.. cus everything all kinda shuddered and your post disappeared.. not to worry.. I saved some of it for you.. see above.

:) :)

I see what you mean Aliena (although I did find the thread I was asking for now!).

I had no doubt you would find it Ronny.. all you needed was a little guidance but.. these silly bits of fluff still fouling up the system simply wont do.. sort it out please.. theres a good chap!

:) :)

[QUOTE=ronald][LEFT]The House Rules are meant to define the direction of this forum.

Those coupled with the fact that this forum is about Italy and, as such, should remain as far as possible on this topic defines the direction of the forum.

I urge all of you to read the House Rules and I am happy to accept any suggestions on how they could be changed, etc.

Ronald[/LEFT][/QUOTE]

Where would you like suggestions posted? Here, new thread in open forum, CdC or by PM?
:confused:

Stodge..

Don't worry about that for the moment.. until you have some sensible suggestions anyway, but for now.. give Ronny and the Ronnettes a break.

The music industry is hard enough these days.

:) :)