 Buon giornoThis is my first post and I hope

04/09/2010 - 14:48

Buon giorno

This is my first post and I hope i have done everything correctly.

I am researching my late fathers war time military history which involves his time as a POW in Italy. I hope that someone on your website may be able to help in some way with local knowledge.

My father was serving with the 1st Special Air Service and was captured on 17 Dec 1942 800 miles behind enemy lines near Tripoli. He was taken by boat to Palermo, then onto various transit camps namely Campo 62 Capua, Campo 70 Porto St Giorgio, Campo 62 Bergamo and finally on the 6 May 1943 Campo 62/33 Milan. I’m not sure where 62/33 was but he worked in a laundry. It may have been a hospital. On the 10 September 1943, it appears from his MI9 debriefing, that he escaped or was let out in the confusion of that moment in time. According to his escape report:

“Two of us left the camp and took refuge in an air-raid shelter as there were so many Germans about at the time. After two days the Germans came and we had to run for it. A priest called us into a church where he hid and fed us for two days and two nights. The priest then took us to Milan station and took us by train to a small village about 20kms from the frontier. He then left us, after giving us the directions, and we then walked into Switzerland after two days march”.

I believe he crossed into Chiasso, Switzerland.

My brother has since revealed that the church mentioned was in fact “Cathedral Duomo” and having no knowledge of this church, looked it up on the internet to discover it is I believe, the second largest Catholic Cathedral.

My family gave me a 64th Birthday present by paying for a 3 day trip for my wife and I to Bergamo/Milan on the 16th of April. I know it’s short notice but if anyone knows anything about a priest helping escaping POW’s who may have an association with Cathedral Duomo I would love to hear. Also I would love to go up to the place where he was hiding in the church. He told us that he used to watch the people below during the church services. I assume that this would be off limits to tourist’s.

Thank you for taking the time to read this post and look forward to any replies with any information of any kind.

I see from a post in 2005 that I am not the only one with a similar request. www.italymagazine.com/forums/general-chat-about-italy/938-where-grumilina-please.html

Grazie

Topic

Culture

Comment

Thanks for your post, this is a fascinating subject, I hope that others are able to help, we live in Marche, which already has members researching, and I know Italian families here who have a long memory of the people they helped during the war. and the children of UK servicemen still come and visit them after all this time. Good luck with your search.

Thanks for your reply - I am discovering in my research that their were many many Italians that risked their lives helping allied POW's and many more that gave their lives to which we are so grateful for.

Hi Geoff. As far as I can tell, the Pow Camp PG62 was located in/around Grumilina (Bergamo). The /33 element of the camp's number refers to it being a satellite of the main PG62 camp. There are seven known satellite camps including Gamba, Cremona and Torbole for PG62 usually work camps coming under the supervision of the main camp, hence PG62/1, PG62/2, PG62/3 etc, etc. If your camp number (/33) is correct, then this would suggest that there are many more. One possibility is that /33 might be a sub-unit of the third satellite camp to PG62 ie PG62/3-3. There are some other sources that I can tap into for information, so If I find out anything more I'll post it here in your thread. Regards.

Thanks Centauro - I am extremely grateful for the information and your offer of help. Best Wishes Geoff

Hi Geoff Not your prison camp, but for a mass of info regarding PoWs and their Italian helpers you could look here: http://camp59survivors.wordpress.com/ and this more general site: http://www.pegasusarchive.org/pow/frames.htm and this: http://www.prisonerofwar.org.uk/ There will probably be Italian sites regarding the Resistance in and around Milan. You could try writing to the Milan section of the National Association of Partisans: Comitato Regionale ANPI LOMBARDIA - via San Marco 49 - 20121 Milano. tel. 02 76020620 Fax 02 784675. e-mail: info@anpilombardia.191.it BTW "Duomo" is the Italian for Cathedral - it seems your father was sheltered in Milan Cathedral

Thank you very much for the information - I will spend some time looking at those websites you have suggested. I will contact the NAP as soon as possible. Thank you also for the translation of "Duomo" It looks as if I have been referring to it as "Cathedral Cathedral" Oh dear!! Thanks once again Geoff

Hi, Geoff. It is, indeed, a fascinating subject and it is true that many Italians risked their own lives helping POWs. Have you read Eric Newby's autobiograpphy? I hope you enjoy your trip and manage to find out more.

Thank you for your good wishes Patz. N I have not read this, I am not aware of the author but will search the internet for more information. Thanks once again. Geoff

Geoff. Further to my earlier reply take a look at this PDF document, I regret that it's in Italian but it deals with the precise camp that you are interested in. If you know any Italian speakers, perhaps one of them might be able to translate it for you, I'm afraid my Italian doesn't stretch nearly far enough. http://www.gramscibergamo.it/INIZIATIVE/20090425/20090425_mostra.pdf Regards. Centauro.

Centauro that's fantastic - I cannot express enough my gratitude at the trouble you have gone to to find this information. I live in Leighton Buzzard in Bedfordshire which is home to a large Italian population, some of which are friends and work colleagues. I will pester one of them to translate as much of this as possible. Thank you once again and I will keep you informed. Best wishes Geoff

Di niente Geoff. But I can't take the credit. Kudos belongs to one of my on-line contacts who dug up the info. I'll pass on your thanks asap. Good luck with the rest of your research. Regards. Centauro

Hi Geoff and thanks for joining us. happy you got help from the community re your research in bocca al lupo! Valentina

Hi Valentina Yes, I have had some good help from the kind people on here. The line in Italian I'm ashamed to say will have to wait for translation at some stage later. Unless you care to do it for me know Kind regards Geoff

Sorry to say that we are not going to make it to Bergamo this weekend due to the Icelandic Volcano - ah well that's life -

Hooray, We have re-booked our trip for the 21st May - Hopefully we can make it this time!

Hi Geoff, Better late than never as they say. Last October I visited PG62 Bergamo with my son and a friend in October 2009 as I am following my own father’s escape into Switzerland. Through a very good friend I have made in Darfo we located PG62 and also PG62/PG56 which is not stated in any references that I could find. This he found for us on the very last morning of our stay to which we were are eternally grateful to him and a twelve year old boy (see below) as we could not speak Italian Here is a link to an article that my friend found plus also a link to the also a newspaper article written about PG62. http://www.gramscibergamo.it/index2.html http://www.eco.bg.it/EcoOnLine/CRONACA/2008/04/25_25_aprile.shtml I also have a copy of another article written about the camp that my friend also found which I have made a rough translation and pictures of following our visit to the camp. Its exact location Grumello Plan as there is another Grumello which caused problems on the sat nav, however the best way marker to me is a road island at Lallio which is adjacent to a cemetery car park. Opposite the car park is a garden/park which has in it a memorial to the prisoners of war that were detained in the camp including Italians who were also held there by the Nazi invaders and has the camp with its distinctive chimney behind it. You will have to excuse me as I am not used to such methods of communication and if you can contact me I can let you have the pictures to use as way markers. In closing our trip was very successful following the efforts of my friend which involved me finding the family who helped my father on his initial escape, plus also a young lad on the very last morning who was of twelve years of age in September 1943 and had contact with the prisoners. Someone must have been guiding us on our visit and thanks for the links your enquiry has generated as I need to further help on my fathers escape route into Switzerland in particular the partisans. The generosity shown to us by the people we met will never be forgot, plus the very brave Italian people who helped all the escapers.

Hi Sherwood Have just sent you a private message. Kind regards Geoff

Hi Sherwood Are you out there? I would love to hear from you - I leave for Bergamo on Friday Morning. Kind regards Geoff

Glad you had so much success Sherwood. You both might find interesting an article to be published on this site by the weekend (or so I'm promised by the webmaster) http://camp59survivors.wordpress.com/ The site is dedicated to a PoW camp much further South, but does include stories of those who passed through and on elsewhere. It will include the story of a PoW, Norman Davison, who was on work detail in Vigevano, South of Milan, and the Italians who helped him after the Armistice. His son John has just tracked them down through the wonders of the internet. Good luck with your search Geoffb