Electrical Safety

Great practical advice, Sparky. Thank you. We had the house inspected by an electrician when we bought it, but your simple and easy test will help many buyers. Safety is most important.

Italian electrical wiring is a strange and wonderful (terrifying?) thing , all the connections to light fittings in my house are by way of two wires twisted together, I am replacing these with little terminal blocks - so simple but why not in the first place? and the switches are pretty tacky things too . Ah well!

Sparky, you say:"Look for the test button on the salva vita and press it. The power should automatically go off."Fine. No problem. That's what the test button on an Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker is for and that's exactly what should happen."If this is the case then close all the circuit breakers and turn the salva vita back on, then reinstate the circuit breakers one at a time.If the power does not automatically turn off then the unit is faulty and should be replaced by a competent registered electrician."Say what?First, in the context of electrical stuff in English, "to close" means "to switch 'On'". (That's because what happens inside the switch is that the contacts "close" or come into contact with each other.)Therefore, what you seem to be saying is that you should switch all the normal circuit breakers On and then "reinstate" -- or switch them On -- again. Which is clearly nonsense.Therefore, what you must mean is that you're supposed to switch the normal circuit breakers OFF while the ELCB is tripped (in an Off state), then turn the normal circuit breakers ON one by one.However, you then assert that the ELCB is supposed to trip each time a circuit breaker is switched On. You go on to say that, if the ELCB does not trip, it is faulty and a registered electrician needs to be called in to replace it.I'm not a qualified electrician, but this makes absolutely no sense to me.Why should the ELCB trip (i.e. detect a fault) when current is applied to it? Surely, if the ELCB trips in this situation, it means exactly what it means every other time this happens: that the current on the Live and Neutral lines is not in balance. In other words, that there is a fault in the electrical system downstream from the ELCB.In our house, there are three circuit breaker boxes, each with an ELCB and normal circuit breakers. None of them are older than five years. One is less than two years old (I know because I installed it – it’s not brain surgery, it’s a matter of switching off at the meter, disconnecting two wires from the old, suspect, ELCB, putting them in a new ELCB, screwing down the contacts and sticking it back in the box).None of the ELCBs work as you say they should.Are you seriously suggesting that, even though the Test button works as it should on each of the ELCBs and they trip at the slightest provocation (like a lamp blowing when switched on) the fact that they don't trip when power is first applied to the circuit means the ELCBs in this house have suffered a 100% failure rate and they all need to be replaced by an electrician like you?AlPS: Are we ever going to get a proper "quote" function here like they have on real internet forums?

But, having read your post for the fifth time or so, I finally realised what was making me think that you were giving daft advice that would make people unnecessarily concerned about the state of their electrics.You said:"Look for the test button on the salva vita and press it. The power should automatically go off.If this is the case then close all the circuit breakers and turn the salva vita back on, then reinstate the circuit breakers one at a time.If the power does not automatically turn off then the unit is faulty and should be replaced by a competent  registered electrician."I read this as you saying that the ELCB should trip when the circuit breakers were turned on again. I now see that what you mean is that if the ELCB did not trip when the Test button was pushed, then the unit is faulty and needs to be replaced.If you had placed the second sentence above immediately after your instructions to press the Test button on the ELCB, I would have had no issues with your post.However, the comment about how the ELCB should trip immediately follows directions to turn on the circuit-breakers. Therefore it could be read as applying to that instruction.My point about the definition of "close" stands. Your directions in the first sentence above are that the circuit breaker should be turned on and then turned on. Any English dictionary will tell you that a switch is "open" when it is Off and "closed" when it is On. Clearly, to "reinstate" a switch which is normally On, one turns it On.In any case, using "open" and "closed" when talking about switches is semi-jargon. If you want to use non-technical language, far better to use "On" and "Off" when talking to laypeople: those are the labels on the switch and so unambiguous. However, if you are going to talk about a switch being "closed", at least apply that term to the correct state.Al

 Hi Sparky,I have some sympathy with Alan cos you confused me too, but Alan confused me even more. I can only follow one or two logical trains at a time. Anyway never mind about all that. I'd like to know your thoughts on pros & cons of English versus Italian domestic wiring. I love the Italian conduit system. So easy to repair & adapt. Why no ring main though........ it's got to be better. Brit sparkys respect polarity but the Italians will run a live on any old colour. They, I must admit, see the value of double pole switching but probably only to keep their ambivalent polarity safer: but then again there's always the good old RCCB to Salva your Vita.So what's to stop you running 2.5mm twin & earth ring-mains in Italian conduit for power circuits & even connecting up good old UK 2-gang sockets & running lighting circuits in twin & earth too. Bet it couldn't be classed as illegal or unsafe providing the salva vita is included.Pilch